.410 Indian Musket Loads for Deer Hunting

[vz24steve]

Hello All!

I am new on here and just wondered if anyone has any experience making loads for the .410 Indian Musket (smoothbore conversion of .303 SMLE)? Mine is in the original chamber, that is not opened up to commercial .410 upon import into the US market. I do have some original single ball cartridges which are spot on accurate for a smoothbore at 35 yards but would like to save the rest of what I have.

 

[robtattoo]

Lee Enfield .410 Musket

I've got one of these oddballs, and can't find any info on reloading it. Any help would be appreciated. Mine has not been rebored for the modern .410 shotshell. Thanks!

www.thehighroad.org

I found this, if it's any help.

 

[vz24steve]

Thanks! Lots of good info there! The double .410 ball would be the ticket for deer by the sounds of it. A fire-forming I go! Just not sure where to find .410 round ball perhaps muzzleloader .395 from Hornady would suffice? Perhaps even powder coat them with the extra room?

 

[robtattoo]

Here you go!

Balls & shot for muzzle loading guns - Track of the Wolf

Balls & shot for muzzle loading guns Hornady round balls are die swaged from pure soft lead. Each ball is perfect, no shrinkage, no sprue, no wrinkles. Hornady round balls are made in the most popular calibers. Hand cast round balls are cast from pure soft lead. Each ball has a tiny flat, where...

www.trackofthewolf.com

 

[robtattoo]

How you're going to crimp them into the case, well..... that's going to take a couple of beers & some ingenuity!

 

[vz24steve]

Sweet! Thank you for suggestion robtatto, that is exactly what I would need. I assume they make these on a custom mold maybe RCBS. Either way there is no way with today's prices I'd be able to afford such a mold, it would cost more than I paid for the musket...$69 from Century (Springfield Sporters buyout). I might experiment with what balls I have in the meantime to see if I can get it going. Replicating the original loading would be cool!

About crimping them I will have to peek around the specs of the dies that I have to maybe get creative. Beer will certainly help Too bad there are no dies out there for the .410 Indian Musket...Pretty please Lee Precision!!!

 

[FLAK]

I have a 000 buckshot mold I bought just for the .410.

 

[vz24steve]

FLAK, what does that mold throw? Correct me if I am mistaken, but doesn't 000 usually something like .350 ish in diameter? Those would be perfect in actual .410 commercial brass/plastic shells as I have experienced out of a S&W Governor, I think they were Federals, shot really well at self defense ranges better than Win PDX I had been using. That said PDX does have a unique payload and has been the most reliable in extraction from the cylinder if all the shotshells I've run through mine.

However, I cannot use any commercial .410 out of my original chambered Indian Musket. There are those out there that have been modified to do so.

 

[vz24steve]

For those interested, these are what the originals I have on hand look like.

 

[FLAK]

that 000 mold is .360

 

[Fatcamp]

Could you explain what you are talking about, please?

 

[robtattoo]

Could you explain what you are talking about, please?

The .410 IM is an old Lee Enfield, usually that had a shot out .303 barrel.
The barrel was reamed out to .410 smoothbore. The chamber was reamed to take out any taper & remove the bottleneck.
The Indian police were then issued these salvaged guns during the 40s & 50s for crowd control purposes.

A lot were imported to the states in the 60s & the chambers were usually re-reamed to accept commercial .410 ammo.

'Originals' like this need to have brass formed from .303 brit, then are loaded with a low power charge, a shit-ton of over powder wadding & a single, crimped, .410 round ball.

 

[robtattoo]

 

[robtattoo]

From my, admittedly limited, understanding, most of these conversations were done by shadetree gunsmiths, licensed by the Ishapore arsenal & they vary in tolerance so badly, that is not at all unusual to have to put an o-ring on each cartridge casing, butted up to the rim to take up the massively excessive headspace. Some times the firing pin literally will not reach the primer!

 

[vz24steve]

Yes, indeed, what robtattoo said. Rough projects like mine are still from Century Arms but I must say, be prepared for a project for sure. You can find nice ones "in the wild" but do beware of headspace issues as mentioned.

Fun to shoot with OG ammo, but I don't want to crack open my sealed case just yet. My 60's vintage still goes off with a bang and I have yet to have a mis/hangfire out of 'em but your mileage may vary. So, making an equivalent is my focus of late. I'll keep you posted with what I cook up, but am always open to suggestions.

 

[Fatcamp]

Well, how interesting. Post a picture, OP.

 

[vz24steve]

I wouldn't mind in the least. It isn't much to look at but this "rescue" has come a long way...

 

[vz24steve]

Didn't see a deer though but I was prepared to explain to the game warden when asked why I am hunting with an Enfield while it's shotgun only season.

Also here are the contents of my factory rounds...

 

[Fatcamp]

That is so interesting. Thanks for sharing.

 

[vz24steve]

While not meant for large game, small game at close range may be taken with a Hammond Game Getter which I had custom made in this peculiar caliber. I haven't had the chance to test fire it but I do have one in .303 and is a hoot at 20 yards, feels like a squib though at first. Plus side is with all the ammo craziness shooting my .303 for $0.14/shot was much appreciated!

Hammond Game Getter Cartridge Adapter

Fire-forming for my conversion cases will be attempted soon!