Follow up shots with a .223 on Elk and Mule deer

[WKR]

I'm curious to hear some data from the guys who are using a .223 on elk and mule deer.

Do you find that most kills require 2 or more hits to harvest the animal?

If so, what is the average needed on the game you have taken.

For the purposes of this thread, head/neck and sub 200 yard shots don't need to be included in the data set.

 

[Formidilosus]

I'm curious to hear some data from the guys who are using a .223 on elk and mule deer.

Do you find that most kills require 2 or more hits to harvest the animal?

Not required, but often there are follow up shots due to most of the people I am around that are using them, all shoot animals until they drop and stop movement, and they do multiple shots on average with all calibers/cartridges- even 338’s average 2-3 rounds.

If so, what is the average needed on the game you have taken.

If you are someone that shoots and waits for them to fall, one is all that is needed. I shoot until they stop moving and I shoot as quickly as possible regardless of chambering- I’ve done 6 round kills with magnums and lots of one round kills with a 223.

 

[WKR]

Not required, but often there are follow up shots due to most of the people I am around that are using them, all shoot animals until they drop and stop movement, and they do multiple shots on average with all calibers/cartridges- even 338’s average 2-3 rounds.





If you are someone that shoots and waits for them to fall, one is all that is needed. I shoot until they stop moving and I shoot as quickly as possible regardless of chambering- I’ve done 6 round kills with magnums and lots of one round kills with a 223.

Do you ever see CNS or hydrostatic shock with the 223?

And if you had to quantify it into numbers, what percentage of 223 kills have needed more than 2 hits on target to put the animal down.

 

[Pharmseller]

If they’re standing, I’m shooting.

.223 Rem isn’t legal for elk in Oregon.




P

 

[Formidilosus]

Do you ever see CNS or hydrostatic shock with the 223?

? CNS every time you shoot it. Hydrostatic shock isn’t a thing in terminal ballistics.

And if you had to quantify it into numbers, what percentage of 223 kills have needed more than 2 hits on target to put the animal down.

“Needed”? Three out of hundreds- one lower leg hit, one gut shot, one hind quarter.

 

[WKR]

? CNS every time you shoot it. Hydrostatic shock isn’t a thing in terminal ballistics.




“Needed”? Three out of hundreds- one lower leg hit, one gut shot, one hind quarter.

Ok let me rephrase,
How many took one shot to go down vs multiple shots?

 

[eric1115]

Ok let me rephrase,
How many took one shot to go down vs multiple shots?

A couple years ago I put 4 180 Berger hybrids through the chest of an elk at 400 yards as it stood there wobbling before it tipped over. Probably 15-20 seconds, and 4-5 steps. How many shots did that "take" by your definition?

I've shot elk once in the chest once with a 178 ELDX and had it run over the ridge and die 150 yards away on the other side. How many shots did that "take"?

Having the ability to put multiple rounds in an animal has little bearing IMO on whether or not they are needed. I would have shot that elk more times if it had stayed on my side of that ridge. Neither of those elk did what they did because of the amount of gun I was using.

 

[KenLee]

If they’re standing, I’m shooting.

.223 Rem isn’t legal for elk in Oregon.




P

I'll shoot again if they are down and "rock" a lil bit. "You're not getting up on me!"

 

[Marbles]

 

[mt100gr.]

 

[TaperPin]

View attachment 666894

Am I the only one that saw this picture, thought what a great target for the 22-250, and only then even noticed the people behind him? Apparently never take me varmint hunting without a chaperone. *chuckle*

 

[Pharmseller]

I'll shoot again if they are down and "rock" a lil bit. "You're not getting up on me!"

That’s funny. I shot a big 5x5 a second time even when he was on his back. Back at camp when I was telling the story my dad asked me why the second shot. “Because he blinked.”

Good enough.





P

 

[KenLee]

That’s funny. I shot a big 5x5 a second time even when he was on his back. Back at camp when I was telling the story my dad asked me why the second shot. “Because he blinked.”

Good enough.

View attachment 666906



P

I got the opposite from my Daddy when I was first turned loose with a 12 ga and 00 buckshot. "If they are over 50 yards, shoot again if his even his ear twitches. "

 

[mattg65]

Am I the only one that saw this picture, thought what a great target for the 22-250, and only then even noticed the people behind him? Apparently never take me varmint hunting without a chaperone. *chuckle*

I wouldn’t worry about them, most of them will move after your first shot.

 

[Formidilosus]

Ok let me rephrase,
How many took one shot to go down vs multiple shots?

I’m not being a jerk here, however- now let me rephrase-

If an animal is still on its feet, or actively trying to get up- it continues to get shot until isn’t. I average 2-3 seconds between shots on animals when prone regardless of distance. Other than those theee I mentioned above, none of the big game animals I have killed or seen killed with the 223/TMK would have required more than one shot.
What do you think happens when you shove a coke can 16-18” deep through the chest of an animal? Do you believe it matters what diameter bullet created the wound?

The last “magnum” kills from me that I can remember were- 6, 1, 3, 2, 1, 2, 3, 4, 1, 1, 1. All of those the first shot went through both lungs. So does that mean magnums average 2.27 shots to go down? Or does it mean that had I/we shot and then waited for the animal to fall it would have been 1?

The last 223/77gr TMK kills were 1, 2, 1, 3, 1, 1, 2, 7 (in 6-7 seconds), 2, 1, 1. All of these the first shot went through both lungs, save one it was stomach. So does that mean that the 223/TMK averages 2 shots to go down? Or does it mean that had I/we waited for the animal to fall it would have been 1?

All of these questions (and probably all others) could be answered in a thread here with hundreds of kills in it.

 

[WKR]

The last “magnum” kills from me that I can remember were- 6, 1, 3, 2, 1, 2, 3, 4, 1, 1, 1.

The last 223/77gr TMK kills were 1, 2, 1, 3, 1, 1, 2, 7 (in 6-7 seconds), 2, 1, 1. All of these the first shot went through both lungs, save one it was stomach.

Valid answer. That's the data I was looking for.

I dont have a horse in this race, just was interested in what people that are using a .223 have experienced.

 

[Drenalin]

I'll shoot again if they are down and "rock" a lil bit. "You're not getting up on me!"

This is off topic because it was a whitetail, but the biggest buck I ever killed took a 150-grain Fusion through the lungs at around 100 yards, hit the deck, then lunged like he was trying to get to his feet. I put another in him immediately, and then put a third between his shoulder blades as he lay on the ground with his back to me. I'm not sure he was still moving after the second shot, but I'm also not sure he wasn't. It seemed like it happened pretty quick and I wasn't taking any chances with him getting up and taking off.

 

[KenLee]

This is off topic because it was a whitetail, but the biggest buck I ever killed took a 150-grain Fusion through the lungs at around 100 yards, hit the deck, then lunged like he was trying to get to his feet. I put another in him immediately, and then put a third between his shoulder blades as he lay on the ground with his back to me. I'm not sure he was still moving after the second shot, but I'm also not sure he wasn't. It seemed like it happened pretty quick and I wasn't taking any chances with him getting up and taking off.

My Daddy's rule #3: You can't eat what you can't find.

 

[roosiebull]

I'm curious to hear some data from the guys who are using a .223 on elk and mule deer.

Do you find that most kills require 2 or more hits to harvest the animal?

If so, what is the average needed on the game you have taken.

For the purposes of this thread, head/neck and sub 200 yard shots don't need to be included in the data set.

I have very little 223 data, I used an AR for a short minute, my wife killed her first blacktail buck with it, I killed a big Tom lion with it

The cat I called in, first shot was quartered to pretty steep, was shooting 77gr smk for both critters. First shot I saw impact perfectly, he hopped broadside and I shot him right behind the shoulder, that knocked him down and he was rolling around, shot him again in the chest, then he made it back to his feet moving away and I hit him one more time in front of the hip almost facing away… he barely made it out of sight, but it was crazy thick, I called him into one of the only openings… these shots all happened in just a few seconds, it was probably 5 seconds total, but I was able to stay perfectly on him every shot lending almost instant follow up shots… at the time, that part didn’t click how awesome that was to be able to put so many good shots on target so fast

My wife’s buck walked out of the timber and bedded down in a grown up clear cut, he was quartered to, told my wife where to aim, and she made a good shot, he got to his feet and she knocked him back down for good with a quick follow up shot… again, at the time, very green hunter, yet she was able to stay on target and make a quick follow up shot… again, at the time, I didn’t appreciate the value that had.

I have taken a lot of new hunters out, and getting them back on target after a shot is often difficult, a light recoiling round and scope at proper magnification lends to very quick follow up shots, and I will keep shooting regardless of cartridge.

I like neck shooting deer, so that’s always a one and done, but if I shoot for lungs, I will always go to the neck for a follow up unless there is a reason I shouldn’t, I try not to shoot up the front shoulders if I can avoid it

I will have more data points this year

 

[KenLee]

Am I the only one that saw this picture, thought what a great target for the 22-250, and only then even noticed the people behind him? Apparently never take me varmint hunting without a chaperone. *chuckle*

I'll never forget setting up a box stand for my brother just off his side yard. He wanted the box up the hill another 40 yards. I protested that it would be getting a lil too flat to the food plot down the hill. His memorable response was "I own everything behind it. Let them get theirs if they intrude." He has a silver tongue. Sounded better than "F em".