Meat Shelf Question

[tyeager2964]

So the definitive argument about meat shelves is that it places weight farther away from your spine.

I don't have a pack with this ability so I would like someone to measure for me:

If you place the meat in the pack then off your back you would have a frame, the bag fabric, meat and camp (in the bag) then the other side of the bag and anything strapped outside the pack. These all have a thickness and volume.

If you put the meat in the shelf the. The order only changes from meat and pack bag fabric. This shouldn't in my mind really change the depth of your pack or center of gravity of the pack.

Can anyone actually test this and measure it to set my mind one way or the other

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

I guess I am confused. I thought that a meat shelf was in between the bag and the frame, like Kifaru does it. Am I wrong here and is there another meat shelf system out there that is different?

 

[blkqi]

The shelf facilitates keeping meat as close to and flat to the frame as possible. The bag acts to strap the meat tight to the frame.

You may be able to achieve a similar configuration without the shelf (meat in the main bag), but it is more difficult to do.

Other benefits include keeping meat separate from gear and the ability to accommodate meat even with a full bag (expansion).

Just a useful tool, you are not wrong to do it any other way that works.

 

[Lockster]

The shelf facilitates keeping meat as close to and flat to the frame as possible. The bag acts to strap the meat tight to the frame.

You may be able to achieve a similar configuration without the shelf (meat in the main bag), but it is more difficult to do.

Other benefits include keeping meat separate from gear and the ability to accommodate meat even with a full bag (expansion).

Just a useful tool, you are not wrong to do it any other way that works.

I agree I think it makes good sense, the meat is inevitably the densest thing in your pack, you would definitely want it closest to our back.

I can understand wanting to pack meat and camp gear all together if you had a massive pack and all your camp was in dry bags.

You could have the camp gear positioned in the bottom of the pack and all the meat sat up on top of the dry bag, thereby keeping it all vertically tight against your back, but I personally prefer to keep the meat separate from the bag and then any blood etc just dried on the outside rather than stinking up the inside of the bag.

It seems to be very much a personal preference thing.

 

[bmart2622]

Kurt from Stone Glacier has a very good explanation of this on their website

 

[mfllood3800]

Hauling meat inside a pack designed for this process is the easiest way to haul meat- unzip bag, put in meat zip bag compress straps
I too like hauling against the frame sheet and keeping my gear in the bag, But if I am wore out, tired, I may throw the meat in the bag and get the heck out there.
I have been so dehydrated after skinning an elk, quartering it up hanging it, that my hands and fingers have been so cramped, I could barely reattach some of the necessary straps and clips and buckles and such.

Using the meat shelf idea in general requires a few more steps and undoing of some stuff and then reattaching it.
I try to modify my packs to simplify this requirement to make the meat shelf idea less of a hassle. When your extremities quit cooperating, you are cold, wet, exhausted , dehydrated and cramped- you just need simple. Cause that 3 mile walk isn't gonna help things one bit

 

[frankrb3]

The original question is confusing, but if you don't have a meat shelf don't worry about it. Just throw your meat in your bag and go. Most of the guys I hunt with don't use a meat shelf. They either throw it in their bag, strap it to their frame, drag it with a rope or throw it over their shoulder. Plenty of ways to skin this cat and as long as you get it home without spoiling you did it right.

 

[tyeager2964]

So to maybe clarify the original question

Does packing meat in the meat shelf really change the center of gravity of a pack? The depth of the pack should really not change whether the meat is in the shelf or not as you are still packing all of the same items and compressing the bag as much as possible.

The only way to tell would be to pack a bag with meat (or sandbag) and camp/hear and measure it's depth and height then compare that to meat (sandbag) put in the load shelf area and camp/gear in the pack and then measure it.

In my mind I cannot see how the measurements would be different as you have the same items overall and would compress everything as much as possible.

 

[frankrb3]

So to maybe clarify the original question

Does packing meat in the meat shelf really change the center of gravity of a pack? The depth of the pack should really not change whether the meat is in the shelf or not as you are still packing all of the same items and compressing the bag as much as possible.

The only way to tell would be to pack a bag with meat (or sandbag) and camp/hear and measure it's depth and height then compare that to meat (sandbag) put in the load shelf area and camp/gear in the pack and then measure it.

In my mind I cannot see how the measurements would be different as you have the same items overall and would compress everything as much as possible.

I gotcha. The meat shelf is definitely designed (at least on my stone glacier xcurve) to hold the meat tight against the frame. If i were to put it in the bag then I would have to use a lot of cordage and straps to try to keep it tight against the back of the bag (where you want it). Also, if my bag is full of gear I'm not left with enough room to haul as much meat out as my legs can handle. So to answer your question, if you were to take an empty pack, fill it with meat, and cinch the crap out of all the straps so that it's tight against your back then the center of gravity probably isn't going to change much. The advantage of the meat shelf is it allows you to haul out the most meat your legs can take while also allowing you to pack out what ever you got in your pack.

 

[Big Nasty]

I like the meat shelf for the purposed of keeping the heavy meat closet to your back. Plus the ease of loading 150lb moose quarter into the shelf and not a bag where it wouldn't fit, especially with bone in quarter and the height of the quarter is well above the pack.

 

[WV Mountaineer]

Everyone that says packing meat in the bag versus against your back on the shelf, is better for your center of gravity, is likely speaking of internet lore versus actual field testing. Here's the deal, if you are packing camp and meat, the meat is going to be heavier, more dense, and exaggerate it's felt weight the farther from the back it gets. There is no way around that. Physics prove it. So getting it closer to your back is the better thing.






I've watched as many Aron Snider video's as anyone. I totally respect him and his abilities. But, his preference has become a lot of people's gospel simply because he is Aron. Nothing meant about that towards anyone, especially Aron. But, there aren't many Aron's in this world. He's a beast that can fill a 5000 plus cubic inch pack with meat and heavy gear and, actually get it out of the woods more efficiently than making three or four trips. There ain't many people that is going to do that. So, why would they base their preferences on his unique ability?






The reason so many here want big bags is so they can haul meat and other stuff at the same times, in the bag. It is true that if you have a big bag, you can get a lot of heavy stuff in it to go along with the meat. But, unless you are shooting podcasts or filming hunting video's, there is zero way your day hunting gear or, camp is going to outweigh the meat. And, there is zero chance that many people are truly carrying a 100 pounds of meat plus, 40-50 pounds of gear every trip when they pack meat. Which is why I don't understand the love affair with big pack bags and, the ideology that it works better than a modest pack meant for camp with a meat shelf option. It makes me wander just how many times guys have strapped a huge load of meat in their pack bags and actually carried it a-ways. To pack meat n the bags, you got have the right meat bags, you got get it secure, you have to get used to packing it with your gear to make it stay where it belongs versus balling up and settling in the bottom of your bag. And, most importantly, you got to stack it on something in the bag to get it higher up for the best ride. It's simply inefficient and not nearly as practical.




Unless you are a rare breed like Aron, buy a bag with a shelf option, cut weight on the bag by now having the option to buy a smaller bag better suited to carry your camp or gear, and use the MEAT SHELF. To me, the best way to carry a heavy load of gear and a real load of meat, is as simple as 1+2=3. But, I'm a pretty simple guy that does my own thing versus follow the crowd. And, I'm lazy. So, taking the 35 seconds to detach my bag and strap the meat in the shelf, has proven to be the only practical way for me. God Bless men

 

[mfllood3800]

Everyone that says packing meat in the bag versus against your back on the shelf, is better for your center of gravity, is likely speaking of internet lore versus actual field testing. Here's the deal, if you are packing camp and meat, the meat is going to be heavier, more dense, and exaggerate it's felt weight the farther from the back it gets. There is no way around that. Physics prove it. So getting it closer to your back is the better thing.






I've watched as many Aron Snider video's as anyone. I totally respect him and his abilities. But, his preference has become a lot of people's gospel simply because he is Aron. Nothing meant about that towards anyone, especially Aron. But, there aren't many Aron's in this world. He's a beast that can fill a 5000 plus cubic inch pack with meat and heavy gear and, actually get it out of the woods more efficiently than making three or four trips. There ain't many people that is going to do that. So, why would they base their preferences on his unique ability?






The reason so many here want big bags is so they can haul meat and other stuff at the same times, in the bag. It is true that if you have a big bag, you can get a lot of heavy stuff in it to go along with the meat. But, unless you are shooting podcasts or filming hunting video's, there is zero way your day hunting gear or, camp is going to outweigh the meat. And, there is zero chance that many people are truly carrying a 100 pounds of meat plus, 40-50 pounds of gear every trip when they pack meat. Which is why I don't understand the love affair with big pack bags and, the ideology that it works better than a modest pack meant for camp with a meat shelf option. It makes me wander just how many times guys have strapped a huge load of meat in their pack bags and actually carried it a-ways. To pack meat n the bags, you got have the right meat bags, you got get it secure, you have to get used to packing it with your gear to make it stay where it belongs versus balling up and settling in the bottom of your bag. And, most importantly, you got to stack it on something in the bag to get it higher up for the best ride. It's simply inefficient and not nearly as practical.




Unless you are a rare breed like Aron, buy a bag with a shelf option, cut weight on the bag by now having the option to buy a smaller bag better suited to carry your camp or gear, and use the MEAT SHELF. To me, the best way to carry a heavy load of gear and a real load of meat, is as simple as 1+2=3. But, I'm a pretty simple guy that does my own thing versus follow the crowd. And, I'm lazy. So, taking the 35 seconds to detach my bag and strap the meat in the shelf, has proven to be the only practical way for me. God Bless men

Lot's of good and factual info in here.
Many opinions come from guys who regurgitate internet "ideas".

I make sure any pack I get has a meat shelf.
I use when ever possible.
Its just sometimes, its easier to use the bag, sometimes the shelf makes total sense.

I have hauled many elk with out a pack. Just threw qtrs. over my shoulders and hiked out.
My wife was with me years ago and carried the ribs out, cradled in her arms.

Done it a lot of ways over the years, and for me personally, I like the shelf

 

[mfllood3800]

This is my Tahr- 3400 ci pack. It is my smallest of my bags.
This rear Qtr is in the meat shelf with the nag emptied of everything but emerg kit, bladder and some survival gear.
I added 2 compression straps near the top as the bag in this mode doesn't attach at the top and was a little flimsy.

On my larger bags, this isn't needed.
Heck it probably wasn't needed on the Tahr, but I like my loads super tight. I hunt in nasty vertical windfall high elev areas and 99% solo. I don't need a mistake miles deep in there.

I personally like the bigger bags - that's just me.
I have the AMR and the Fulcrum and prefer these for elk.

My Tahr is now my go to mule deer set up.

 

[ljalberta]

My thoughts on using a shelf when you have a full load of gear and meat.... If you stack the meat inside the bag, against the frame (as most people who pack meat in the bag do), it ends up in the exact same place as it would being placed on a meat shelf. Then, with the bag, you can load your gear directly over top of the meat where the bag extends up. This is much closer than you could stack it using a meat shelf. If you're using a meat shelf, and a bunch of gear, you aren't loading it directly over/besides the meat. Instead, you're loading it further away from your back. Some people like the shelf, and more power to them. Try both ways, run with what you like.

The idea that it's a lot of work securely situating the meat inside a bag and the need for 'the right' meat bags is pretty ridiculous to me. It takes seconds to load up meat into a contractor bag and stack it in my bag against the frame precisely where I want it. People have been doing this for years without issue.

 

[mfllood3800]

My thoughts on using a shelf when you have a full load of gear and meat.... If you stack the meat inside the bag, against the frame (as most people who pack meat in the bag do), it ends up in the exact same place as it would being placed on a meat shelf.


- I guess you are missing my point or I am misunderstanding yours. My reason for using the meat shelf- is when there is no room left in the pack bag. When it is full with camp gear. The only other place for meat is between the frame sheet and the pack bag, on the shelf.

 

[Kevin Dill]

Seems I'm always late to the discussion.

Using a meat shelf versus placing meat in the main pack bag (and then cranking it tight to the frame) will produce the same weight placement when carrying only meat. This assumes the shelf and bag place the load at the same height on the frame. When carrying meat and gear, the shelf begins to show some advantages. You simply cannot get the same load volume of meat + gear into a pack bag unless it's a big pack bag. Putting meat on the shelf (next to the frame) allows the entire bag to remain available for gear. It also separates bloody meat from gear which is a huge deal for some, including me.

The main reason I employ a shelf (or cargo sling) is to avoid bloodying the interior of my pack. I'm pretty fanatical about keeping things clean and the last thing I want on an extended hunt is a blood-soaked backpack... especially in serious bear country. To this end is why I went to using a totally waterproof and bloodproof meat packing bag. I slide a loaded regular (white) bag of meat into the meat packing bag, which then can go on the meat shelf or into the pack bag without leaking any blood. I've used this system to pack load after load of meat (10 loads from a moose) and all of it using the meat shelf. I spent 5 minutes adjusting the pack to prepare for meat loads. Each load of meat took about 3 minutes to place on the shelf/frame and then buckle/tighten the pack straps. By the third load I had it down to a science.

 

[tttoadman]

To qualify, I have both. I have a warrior bag and a SG bag with a shelf. I have used both about equally. I would say the only real difference will come in if you have a big lid and side mounted bags that you use for gear. If all you have is a big bag, you are genuinely pushing weight further back. If you have a big lid, the lid can go forward over the meat and it goes in the same place either way. If you have side pockets that only mount to the bag, they are forced further back. If you have dry bags that simply get strapped to the side, those can can be hooked to the straps beside the the meat so they can be forward. As already stated. The reality for most of us we are dropping the majority of our gear to pack meat. by the time I pack the warrior bag with a load of meat. anything above the meat under the lid is about all I will add. Don't discount the method of hooking a gun or bow on. I will never pack meat without my trekking poles. A meat shelf setup may end up with the gun a little further back.

 

[5MilesBack]

If you put the meat straight into your pack with nothing in the bottom of that pack, the bag will sag and the meat will ball up in the bottom if you have no way to distribute it over the height of the bag. Frames with a meat shelf keep the meat higher on the frame. Hint......the meat shelf is higher than the bottom of the bag. It's easier to carry loads higher and closer to your back than down around your rear end.

 

[Big Nasty]

My thoughts on using a shelf when you have a full load of gear and meat.... If you stack the meat inside the bag, against the frame (as most people who pack meat in the bag do), it ends up in the exact same place as it would being placed on a meat shelf.


- I guess you are missing my point or I am misunderstanding yours. My reason for using the meat shelf- is when there is no room left in the pack bag. When it is full with camp gear. The only other place for meat is between the frame sheet and the pack bag, on the shelf.

Exactly, I've used the meat shelf for 5 days extra food on long trips too, not just meat. Works great for anything you need to put in there.

 

[Kevin Dill]

If most guys could use a tapered meat bag...which totally stops the 'balling' effect of meat settling and bulging...they would probably be amazed at what a difference it makes when carrying a heavy meat load. This, whether using a shelf or inside the main bag.