Oxalate's?

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Anyone have any personal experience with oxalate issues or have good info on this subject?

 

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ttt

 

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ttt

 

[go4thegusto]

A friend has had lots of kidney stone issues. His nephrologist recommended the U of Michigan as a good resource on the subject.

 

[V2Pnutrition]

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I’ve worked with a lot of folks on the issue when working clinician nutrition at the hospital. Shoot me a message on the specifics you’re curious and I’m happy to help.

For folks who have/will come across this in a search after hearing how much wild game can increase uric acid and form oxalates- remember the dose makes the poison.

 

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@*zap*

I’ve worked with a lot of folks on the issue when working clinician nutrition at the hospital. Shoot me a message on the specifics you’re curious and I’m happy to help.

For folks who have/will come across this in a search after hearing how much wild game can increase uric acid and form oxalates- remember the dose makes the poison.

thanks but I was just curious about peoples awareness of the oxalate issue. Been on a no carb diet and am sure I am dumping at times. I was not aware of oxalate rich wild game meats.....thanks.

 

[BBob]

No idea if this applies to what you are doing. As a stone former I’m more worried about the affects of meat consumption as it pertains to urine PH. Docs have me supplement with potassium and magnesium to keep my PH in range. My diet is slanted heavily towards meat consumption so it can be an issue. The amount of Oxalates in meats (very low compared to many other foods) is much less of a concern to me than many other foods such as nuts and many green things. I use the OxiPur app as my main guide to Oxalates in food. Since altering my diet based on Dr Coe’s research (and doctors guidance) I have after several decades ceased forming stones. For calcium oxalate stone formers calcium consumption with every meal is another requirement to keep the Oxalates from creating painful things. Yes I am now an annoying person with food restrictions

 

[BadDogPSD]

About a week or two after I went from keto to carnivore I got very itchy on my lower legs & armpits. I was told I was probably dumping oxalates, but not sure.

 

[V2Pnutrition]

thanks but I was just curious about peoples awareness of the oxalate issue. Been on a no carb diet and am sure I am dumping at times. I was not aware of oxalate rich wild game meats.....thanks.

I should’ve clarified- they’re rich in purines…which increases Uric acid…which can be a precursor for development of calcium oxalate stone formation.

They’re actually low in oxalates.

 

[Sapcut]

Eating wild game has got to be the last human food item anyone needs to be concerned with. It is the best, most nutrient dense, bioavailable food we can eat. Essential amino acids, essential fatty acids, excellent omega 3 to 6 ratios, etc., etc. It's almost like it was created and designed that way...Oh wait!

 

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Just to clarify, I am interested in other effects than just kidney stones.

 

[Chuckybmd]

Well, damn, I was going to tell you about my oxalate kidney stone.

Hurt like hell, wished I was dead. To add insult to injury. The sob was only 2 mm.

The only positive is, I got to miss an entire visit from the in-laws.

 

[Chuckybmd]

So I ultimately chose not to drastically alter my diet, but just increase my free water intake. The more water that you drink the more dilute the urine and the less likely to crystallize calcium oxalate.

 

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1 gallon + a day.

 

[Chuckybmd]

1 gallon + a day.

Well, to be honest, my goal is closer to 2 L. But you got to start somewhere.

 

[BBob]

So I ultimately chose not to drastically alter my diet, but just increase my free water intake. The more water that you drink the more dilute the urine and the less likely to crystallize calcium oxalate.

If you are a chronic calcium oxalate stone former just more water does not work as a viable solution. Been down that road. As a rule though 6-8oz of water on the hour of every waking hour is part of the solution. During your sleep you take your chances.

Many have had a single random stone in their life so having one doesn’t mean you should alter your diet and do other other things for chronic stones.

 

[BBob]

Just to clarify, I am interested in other effects than just kidney stones.

So other than stone formers I’ve never heard of anyone interested in or concerned about oxalates as far as diet goes so what’s the deal? A quick and dirty would suffice

As I understand it (and simplified) most people’s actual uptake of oxalates is pretty low regardless of how much they consume. People like me have an anomaly where far more of the oxalates pass through the blood barrier in the intestine and we end up with way more of them in the bloodstream and ultimately in kidneys which can lead to calcium oxalate stones. So for us we need to reduce and chemically snatch/alter the oxalates in the bloodstream before they hit the kidneys so we don’t form stones. There’s more involved but those are important.

 

[*zap*]

some people have serious issues from eating high oxalate foods....then when they do a no oxalate diet their body dumps oxalates and it is an uncomfortable process.

Issues caused by oxalates include:

• Kidney stones: 80% of kidney stones are made of calcium oxalates.
• Reduced mineral absorption: Oxalates act as “anti-nutrients,” impairing the absorption of minerals like zinc, calcium, and iron.
• Joint pain
• Skin and eye issues
• Fatigue

I will add inflammation to that list.

It is e-z to consume more oxalates than the body can use productively or get rid of. Then the remainder are stored in organs, joints and tissues. Commonly thought of good foods may have high oxalates...spinach tops the list. Sweet potatoes and nuts also. Nut butter is high. Etc.

There are very interesting opinions on this but little research.

 

[BBob]

I never experienced any dumping so no issues there. I don’t have to completely avoid oxalates to avoid stones. I do have to watch and moderate what I eat as far as things that contain oxalates. There are definite no goes. Spinach, rhubarb, nuts (there are more). Very limited grains. Rice is benign so all you want there. Many vegetables are fine in limited quantities. A huge component for this though is my previously mentioned calcium. You eat calcium whenever you eat so you have enough free calcium to bind with the oxalates in the bloodstream. If it’s done in the bloodstream you essentially get rid of it in the urine. Seems counter intuitive when you are trying to avoid calcium oxalate stones but that’s the way it works. If you’re trying to avoid oxalates for other reasons that might be something to think about. Another biggie is salt intake. It has a large effect in the process of making stones. Reducing salt will go a long way in solving the issue. It wasn’t long ago that the medical community thought that was bunk but some epidemiologists found what looked like a real connection. It was studied and they figured out it was a real connection. So basically my plan (successful so far) has been: much reduced intake of oxalates, consume calcium whenever I eat, drink 6-8 ounces of liquids on the hour every hour, reduced salt intake, supplement with potassium magnesium to keep urine ph in check. The recommended calcium is your RDA split equally among your meals.

 

[Sapcut]

As mentioned, most stones are from oxalates. Most if not all oxalates are from dark leafy greens, almonds and other vegetation. Does anyone else see the correlation with the large majority, if not all, negative issues in the human body come from plants. Unlike quality animal products, it is extremely common for plants to create problems in humans but yet so many people are still adamant about eating plants. I just don't get it.