Pup progression

[WRO]

I got back into pointing dogs when I moved to Idaho, ended up grabbing an English setter puppy and let him have his fly away season. Got nervous about him on some stuff and ended up reaching out to JW at lone sage bird dogs to get some lessons. Long story endless, best time and money I've ever spent. Took a wild dog that had caught some training birds and have him 90% broke to shot and flush. Most of all I learned how to handle my dog. I figured out that 95% of dogs problems isn't the dog, it's the handler and owner.

 

[JD Jones]

Beautiful setter!
Love hunting behind mine that’s for sure

 

[PredatorSlayer]

You are lucky - I know of three dogs who were sent to trainers. 2 came back gun shy and 1 had no drive. I have always believed if you buy a good dog with a good pedigree and teach it simple obedience you should be good to go. The whole steady to shot thing is fine on pen raised birds, as soon as you hunt wild birds you will loose almost every bird you wing.

 

[WRO]

You are lucky - I know of three dogs who were sent to trainers. 2 came back gun shy and 1 had no drive. I have always believed if you buy a good dog with a good pedigree and teach it simple obedience you should be good to go. The whole steady to shot thing is fine on pen raised birds, as soon as you hunt wild birds you will loose almost every bird you wing.

I've been at every session with him and learned the process with homework to improve on.

Everyone's dog is perfect when they drop it off, truth is alot of them have the owners mess ups fingerprinted all over them. Not saying that there's not some bad trainers out there, but alot of its the owners fingerprints coming out.

Having a broke dog will kill you more chukars and huns, I can't count how many times we've killed a single had the dogs break and blow the whole covey out 30 yards in front of the single or seen dogs get into the line of fire chasing. A good dog should be able to find a cripple whether or not it chases. Not to mention I hunt alot of places in the cliffs where a chasing dog could very easily fall off and die.

I don't hunt pen raised birds as I'm not out to kill just to kill or give my dogs bad habits.

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[KurtR]

You are lucky - I know of three dogs who were sent to trainers. 2 came back gun shy and 1 had no drive. I have always believed if you buy a good dog with a good pedigree and teach it simple obedience you should be good to go. The whole steady to shot thing is fine on pen raised birds, as soon as you hunt wild birds you will loose almost every bird you wing.

Not really I know of hundreds of dogs sent to trainers who all came back more capable than most handlers. Most will tell you training dogs is easy people not so much. Need to research trainers just as much as pedigrees. . Being steady to flush and shot over I have lost less cripples as the dog can mark where the bird goes down vs running after. All I shoot are wild sd pheasants mostly late season after all the water is froze.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Being steady to flush and shot over I have lost less cripples as the dog can mark where the bird goes down vs running after.

That may work on pen raised birds. Not wild ones…all I shoot are wild dakota birds as well. If you are waiting to send your dog on a retrieve until it hits the ground, it will be a 100 yards away by the time the dog gets there.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

I've been at every session with him and learned the process with homework to improve on.

Everyone's dog is perfect when they drop it off, truth is alot of them have the owners mess ups fingerprinted all over them. Not saying that there's not some bad trainers out there, but alot of its the owners fingerprints coming out.

Having a broke dog will kill you more chukars and huns, I can't count how many times we've killed a single had the dogs break and blow the whole covey out 30 yards in front of the single or seen dogs get into the line of fire chasing. A good dog should be able to find a cripple whether or not it chases. Not to mention I hunt alot of places in the cliffs where a chasing dog could very easily fall off and die.

I don't hunt pen raised birds as I'm not out to kill just to kill or give my dogs bad habits.

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I hunt upland game really hard every year, I got serious about it just over 10 years ago. We hunt Idaho, Montana, Nebraska, Dakotas and Kansas every year. I think you have been watching too many hunting shows with those guys shooting pheasant farms. I used to train my dogs just like your trainer trained yours until I realized it was a joke. That crap is for field trials, which is fine if you are into that. I went out with a buddy a couple years ago and he brought his professional trainer that worked with his dog and the trainer had a bunch of dogs that were steady to wing shot and fall. I limited out behind my dog hours before they did and they ended up asking if they could hunt over mine so they could fill limits at the end of the day. If you want to turn this into a pissing contest with upland experience, I promise you will lose. I also don’t disagree that owners are often times the problem. You guys spend your money however you want to, I am just telling you its not going to bring more birds home

Also, crippled chukars are different than a crippled pheasant. Crippled chukars and huns don’t run like pheasants do. You can probably do just fine with chukars and huns with dogs trained to hunt farm raised pheasants. Crippled Wild pheasants with nasty cover will run forever.

 

[*zap*]

real life and field trials are two different things....

 

[WRO]

I hunt upland game really hard every year, I got serious about it just over 10 years ago. We hunt Idaho, Montana, Nebraska, Dakotas and Kansas every year. I think you have been watching too many hunting shows with those guys shooting pheasant farms. I used to train my dogs just like your trainer trained yours until I realized it was a joke. That crap is for field trials, which is fine if you are into that. I went out with a buddy a couple years ago and he brought his professional trainer that worked with his dog and the trainer had a bunch of dogs that were steady to wing shot and fall. I limited out behind my dog hours before they did and they ended up asking if they could hunt over mine so they could fill limits at the end of the day. If you want to turn this into a pissing contest with upland experience, I promise you will lose. I also don’t disagree that owners are often times the problem. You guys spend your money however you want to, I am just telling you its not going to bring more birds home

Also, crippled chukars are different than a crippled pheasant. Crippled chukars and huns don’t run like pheasants do. You can probably do just fine with chukars and huns with dogs trained to hunt farm raised pheasants. Crippled Wild pheasants with nasty cover will run forever.

I don't hunt ditch parrots so you win.

I hunt wild chukars and huns almost exclusively, I used hunt ditch parrots alot with my flushers, not at all the same as what we do here nor the same approach.

 

[WRO]

real life and field trials are two different things....

I do them both and have been way more successful hunting over broke dogs that run big than peoples self proclaimed "awesome" dogs..

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[JD Jones]

You got that right, everyone has the best dog on the web. I admit off the bat, my dog is wild, she ranges big and she may wait or she may not. Seen her go both ways. Fortunately I don’t take it too seriously. Love watching good dogs work.

Glad you got a pup developing the way you like to hunt!

 

[*zap*]

most everybody loves their dog...

I hunted an english pointer male and a lab/pointer female.....not much got away from us....not sure how they would have done in a trial but I never even thought about training them for that. They were awesome hunting dogs on quail/pheasant. Everyone I hunted with said they never saw a better trained/under control pointer...

 

[WRO]

You got that right, everyone has the best dog on the web. I admit off the bat, my dog is wild, she ranges big and she may wait or she may not. Seen her go both ways. Fortunately I don’t take it too seriously. Love watching good dogs work.

Glad you got a pup developing the way you like to hunt!

That's why I'm breaking my English setter right now, he wasn't consistent on holding and his pocket is about 200-500 yards..

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[WRO]

most everybody loves their dog...

I hunted an english pointer male and a lab/pointer female.....not much got away from us....not sure how they would have done in a trial but I never even thought about training them for that. They were awesome hunting dogs on quail/pheasant. Everyone I hunted with said they never saw a better trained/under control pointer...

I like my English setter, I'm on the fence on my gordon setter, and I'm patiently waiting for my gwp to kick the bucket so I can get a dog I like more. She's going to live forever to spite me, that being said if I could have her back to start over at 8 weeks I'd do it in a heart beat, my issues with her are 100% my fault not hers.

I'm glad you had good ones, out of the box not much beats an English pointer for upland in my limited experience..

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[Ross]

Decades ago reading about training dogs one thing stuck with me you have a rolled up newspaper and every time your dog does something he is not supposed to you grab the paper and whack yourselfreason being You/Me put him in the position to fail….I got whacked a lot on my 2nd lab this has always stuck on my next dogs….I don’t get whacked near as much these days

 

[KurtR]

That may work on pen raised birds. Not wild ones…all I shoot are wild dakota birds as well. If you are waiting to send your dog on a retrieve until it hits the ground, it will be a 100 yards away by the time the dog gets there.

I just live and used to guide in Sodak so pretty sure I got a good grasp how it works. Hunted every day of the season except Christmas Eve and day a few years

 

[280Ackley]

I hunt upland game really hard every year, I got serious about it just over 10 years ago. We hunt Idaho, Montana, Nebraska, Dakotas and Kansas every year. I think you have been watching too many hunting shows with those guys shooting pheasant farms. I used to train my dogs just like your trainer trained yours until I realized it was a joke. That crap is for field trials, which is fine if you are into that. I went out with a buddy a couple years ago and he brought his professional trainer that worked with his dog and the trainer had a bunch of dogs that were steady to wing shot and fall. I limited out behind my dog hours before they did and they ended up asking if they could hunt over mine so they could fill limits at the end of the day. If you want to turn this into a pissing contest with upland experience, I promise you will lose. I also don’t disagree that owners are often times the problem. You guys spend your money however you want to, I am just telling you its not going to bring more birds home

Also, crippled chukars are different than a crippled pheasant. Crippled chukars and huns don’t run like pheasants do. You can probably do just fine with chukars and huns with dogs trained to hunt farm raised pheasants. Crippled Wild pheasants with nasty cover will run forever.

Wow arrogant much?!?!? If your birds are running that much, I’d say your dogs must be much better than you are at shooting!!!

OP great looking dog, best of luck this coming year!

 

[WRO]

Wow arrogant much?!?!? If your birds are running that much, I’d say your dogs must be much better than you are at shooting!!!

OP great looking dog, best of luck this coming year!

Thank you, I'm kind of partial to him. We'll see how he does starting 9/15..

BTW, I tend to notice that there's a pretty high correlation between someone telling you how great they are and then the reality of how full of shit they are in the end.

 

[JGood]

You are lucky - I know of three dogs who were sent to trainers. 2 came back gun shy and 1 had no drive. I have always believed if you buy a good dog with a good pedigree and teach it simple obedience you should be good to go. The whole steady to shot thing is fine on pen raised birds, as soon as you hunt wild birds you will loose almost every bird you wing.

Is this a joke? Are you Russian Bot?

The fact that you only know of three dogs who were sent to pro trainers speaks volumes to the amount of quality of bird dogs you've been around.


@WRO , nice dog and congrats on the puppy. not much is more enjoyble than hunting over great dogs that are truely steady.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Is this a joke? Are you Russian Bot?

The fact that you only know of three dogs who were sent to pro trainers speaks volumes to the amount of quality of bird dogs you've been around.


@WRO , nice dog and congrats on the puppy. not much is more enjoyble than hunting over great dogs that are truely steady.

Thank you, I'm kind of partial to him. We'll see how he does starting 9/15..

BTW, I tend to notice that there's a pretty high correlation between someone telling you how great they are and then the reality of how full of shit they are in the end.

Lots more where that came from … Not everybody on the internet is full of shit. Those are all wild birds…all shot over my dogs point. All retrieved by my dog. All genetics, just general obedience training. I still think it is hilarious that people think they need to train a dog to do what it was bred to do. Just my opinion, you guys keep paying those professional trainers.