Scope Upgrades

[Sweetroels]

I am an old fart with declining vision and need to upgrade glass and capability from current low end good names scopes with duplex reticles to something better



After looking through many different brands of scopes I’ve decided to purchase a Swarovski Z5 for my 30-06 Tika. Then move the VX3 off the 30-06 to my 70-8 Tika for a decent NC deer rifle with shots no longer than 300yds.



The question is do I get Z5 BT, P and/or I versions? I want the 30-06 to be my backup versatility gun and shoot NC deer/pigs/bear 100-300yards then out to 450ish yards for elk and other big game when I go out west. My 300 RUM Christensen Traverse will be my go to for long range big game which I am upgrading to a high-end FFP scope like NF or Leupold 5HD.



I am a newbie moving from standard duplex scopes, I am still confused and never clicked before and don’t know if clicking takes too much time on quick shots? From what I can tell the Z5 BT version you can click and the P is suited for the BRX reticle? Looking at the 5-25x52, I can get illuminated with either the BT or P. I would prefer the 3.5-18 of the Z3 but can only get in a 44, prefer the 52.



If you are limited to Swaro Z5 what would you get? Thanks for any help

 

[madcalfe]

your over thinking twisting the turrets.
once you have your velocities of the bullet your shooting
input the data into a ballistic calculator online.
print out the cheat sheet for example it will have increments of whatever you choose 50 yard, 100 yard

tape cheat sheet to stock.
range say a animal at 500 yard look at the sheet and it says 500 yard dial to 12 moa
twist the turret to 12 moa and bobs your uncle.

there's obviously wind and everything else to take into consideration but ultimately practice at longer ranges dialing and verify your dope chart prior to hunting

 

[Sweetroels]

Thanks Madcalfe. So you recommend the BT version? I have a decent crony that I use when testing my reloads so this could be done, obviously a lot of practice required too. Sorry not that familiar with all the options out there now

 

[madcalfe]

if I personally had to get a Z5 id opt for the 3.5x18x44
I also wouldn't recommend a swaro for dialing constantly though.
you've mentioned that your thinking of upgraded your optics on your 300 rum to a nightforce
ever consider of going that route right now? a NXS is in the same price range than a Z5i

 

[SomeJackassOnAForum]

P is for parallax adjustable and L is for lightweight aluminum construction.

All Z5 5-25x52 and 3.5-18x44 scopes are P/L.

BT indicates "Ballistic Turret". For an SFP scope with a 25x max mag, I'd get the turret rather than the drop reticle.

I expect most of the issues relating to dialing on a Z5 probably come down to the clicks being 1/4" at 100 yds instead of 1/4 MOA. That's a 4% error if you're using someone else's ballistic calculator and don't know.

 

[Sweetroels]

I do not have experience with FFP scopes. Many folks here recommend NF scopes but a majority are SFP, I thought FFP was better for long range? i understand the difference but don't know how that applies out in the field. I pretty much decided to get NF for my 300 RUM but what model and reticle is best for hunting? I would like to keep the reticle simple with the best glass that NF offers.



Still confused on what to get for my 30-06. Doing more research on this site maybe Trijicon, seems to have good reviews here. I don’t think clicking would be good for the shots in NC, quick acquisition and shots usually less than 300 yards

 

[Chad717]

If you’re going to dial at all stick with a Nightforce you will be happier with maintaining zero

 

[BBob]

I expect most of the issues relating to dialing on a Z5 probably come down to the clicks being 1/4" at 100 yds instead of 1/4 MOA. That's a 4% error if you're using someone else's ballistic calculator and don't know.

Exactly. Lots of people don’t realize this. They are an IPHY (inch per hundred yards) and most ballistic calculators/apps have a selection for IPHY so you get the correct output.

 

[SomeJackassOnAForum]

The Z5 5-25x52 is a high mag scope, but not a long range scope. If you're shooting past 600 (maybe 700 depending on cartridge) look elsewhere.

 

[SDHNTR]

Why are you only considering a Swaro Z5? Just do a little searching here. There are much much better choices.

 

[Sweetroels]

Ok. What are your top choices SDHNTR?

 

[SDHNTR]

Ok. What are your top choices SDHNTR?

Big question….

Need to know:
Budget?
Weight limitations (if any, keep in mind anything worthwhile starts at about 24+oz)?
FFP vs SFP preference?
Mil vs MOA preference?

 

[Sweetroels]

I am an old duplex guy. Want to make it easy. Never had a FFP. Getting 2 scopes the NF for the 300 RUM Still deciding on the 30-06. Budget is around $1,500 give or take a few hundred. MOA?

 

[Happy Antelope]

I am an old fart with declining vision and need to upgrade glass and capability from current low end good names scopes with duplex reticles to something better



After looking through many different brands of scopes I’ve decided to purchase a Swarovski Z5 for my 30-06 Tika. Then move the VX3 off the 30-06 to my 70-8 Tika for a decent NC deer rifle with shots no longer than 300yds.



The question is do I get Z5 BT, P and/or I versions? I want the 30-06 to be my backup versatility gun and shoot NC deer/pigs/bear 100-300yards then out to 450ish yards for elk and other big game when I go out west. My 300 RUM Christensen Traverse will be my go to for long range big game which I am upgrading to a high-end FFP scope like NF or Leupold 5HD.



I am a newbie moving from standard duplex scopes, I am still confused and never clicked before and don’t know if clicking takes too much time on quick shots? From what I can tell the Z5 BT version you can click and the P is suited for the BRX reticle? Looking at the 5-25x52, I can get illuminated with either the BT or P. I would prefer the 3.5-18 of the Z3 but can only get in a 44, prefer the 52.



If you are limited to Swaro Z5 what would you get? Thanks for any help

I would say if you are ok sighting in your rifle at 200 yards and feel comfortable shooting to 300 or 400 yards the Ballistic Turret is excellent. It's super easy and takes a second to law down and turn to the red or green dot and be super accurate (assuming you put good info in) I also don't think if you are shooting 300 plus yards s you need to be fast, that extra 1-2 seconds will cost you nothing.

There is not a lot of elevation in that scope so not the choice for super long range. Lots of better scopes if you want to go 500 plus. The weight is a huge plus it's about 1 pound. Glass is good, price point is good. It's a nice choice IMO.

 

[SDHNTR]

There is a cosmetic blem Nightforce NXS 3.5-15x50 on Europtic right now for $1399. With your budget and wanting SFP/MOA, that’s an easy choice!

Second would be a Trijicon Credo HX 2.5-15x42. Also good and around $8-900. Slightly smaller and lighter.

FYI, the Z5 has a paper thin tube. Swaro recommends no more than 17”lbs, which is a joke and should be indicative of the their thoughts about durability of their own scope. They also have cheesy plastic turrets. There’s a reason why it’s so light.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

You'll probably be very well suited by a pair of Nightforce 2 5-10 nxs scopes. 2nd ffp, super reliable, impecanle dialing.

 

[Happy Antelope]

if I personally had to get a Z5 id opt for the 3.5x18x44
I also wouldn't recommend a swaro for dialing constantly though.
you've mentioned that your thinking of upgraded your optics on your 300 rum to a nightforce
ever consider of going that route right now? a NXS is in the same price range than a Z5i

There is a huge weight difference, those 2 scopes are kind of apples and oranges.

 

[Happy Antelope]

If you’re going to dial at all stick with a Nightforce you will be happier with maintaining zero

Been shooting a Z5 for years, dialed it hundreds of times, granted never over 300-400 yards as there is just not much MOA as you know, but for a hunting scope it's fine and haven't adjusted it one time in years. There is absolutely no need to drop 2-3k on a NF to shoot an extra 100-200 yards hunting, let alone add 2 pounds to the rifle. A simple hold over worked for a 100 years on a 300 yard shoot, well before Williams was even born...lol No need to over think it, but if he is shooting 1K yard deer then I agree, go buy a really good SB, NF or whatever, but I have a feeling that's not the case. At 40 yards the NF is like buying a Porsche to grab milk once a week. Not to mention the glass and eyebox on that Z5 will be a lot ore enjoyable than the NX8 which is not really liked and the ATACR is 3x the price.

 

[SDHNTR]

Been shooting a Z5 for years, dialed it hundreds of times, granted never over 300-400 yards as there is just not much MOA as you know, but for a hunting scope it's fine and haven't adjusted it one time in years. There is absolutely no need to drop 2-3k on a NF to shoot an extra 100-200 yards hunting, let alone add 2 pounds to the rifle. A simple hold over worked for a 100 years on a 300 yard shoot, well before Williams was even born...lol No need to over think it, but if he is shooting 1K yard deer then I agree, go buy a really good SB, NF or whatever, but I have a feeling that's not the case. At 40 yards the NF is like buying a Porsche to grab milk once a week. Not to mention the glass and eyebox on that Z5 will be a lot ore enjoyable than the NX8 which is not really liked and the ATACR is 3x the price.

Polite counter argument, if I may…

If only shooting 3-400, why bother dialing?

A NF NXS 2-10 weighs 21 oz, a 3-15 weighs 30. That gets you near bombproof durability. No 17”lbs, 25! and enough to hold. $16-1700 new. Found used for a few hundo less. There’s also the NF SHV 3-10x42 for $1000 and 21 oz. Great choice if you want capped turrets and don’t plan to dial as much.

Split the difference and that Triji CHX 2.5-15 is bomber too and weighs 23 oz. $8-900.

All have better glass than you’ll ever need. All have brass turrets, not cheap plastic. None are $2-3k and 2 lbs.

All that said, if the Z5 blows your skirt up, have at it amigo.

 

[SomeJackassOnAForum]

There is a cosmetic blem Nightforce NXS 3.5-15x50 on Europtic right now for $1399. With your budget and wanting SFP/MOA, that’s an easy choice!

Second would be a Trijicon Credo HX 2.5-15x42. Also good and around $8-900. Slightly smaller and lighter.

FYI, the Z5 has a paper thin tube. Swaro recommends no more than 17”lbs, which is a joke and should be indicative of the their thoughts about durability of their own scope. They also have cheesy plastic turrets. There’s a reason why it’s so light.

Nightforce tells you to use the ring manufacturer's Spec (page 4) https://www.nightforceoptics.com/download/#flipbook-df_20006/4/.

I guess if the ring manufacturer recommends 17 inch lbs (Talley) it's because Nightforce has flimsy tubes, right?

Seems more likely Swaro got tired of people overtorquing rings and came out with a spec on the low side of the ring industry standard so that people wouldn't just grab an Allen key and go to town.

If you want to be able to drop your rifle onto your scope a lot, I probably wouldn't recommend a Z5 because the turret's externals are polymer. If you can hold onto your gun and want a high mag scope primarily inside 500 yds, the higher mag Z5s do that well.

If you want a dialing distance scope with Swaro glass in it get a Kahles, but that's not going to be $1500. (Or 16 oz)