Suppressor wait times

[SloppyJ]

Hello all. I am a very long time lurker and very infrequent poster, but I do feel a need to mention something here. I work for the USG and have extensive experience with background investigations, security clearances, etc. Just so folks know, holding any kind of USG security clearance is irrelevant to the background check associated with purchasing firearms and/or suppressors. The databases that are searched for firearms and/or suppressor purchases do not, in any way, interface with the USG’s databases where security clearances are maintained. It makes me kinda crazy when I hear LGS sales people state that approvals or denials for a weapons sale is somehow related to the customer having or not having a security clearance. If this was true, people with TS/SCIs would be approved much faster because they are subjected to “continuous vetting” as part of holding that clearance, and Uncle Sam pretty much knows what they are up to versus the Average Joe. I speak from experience here. I have had to wait about the average amount of time for all of my suppressor purchases.

Coming from the perspective of a USG supervisor in an agency that regularly interfaces with ATF the reality is that ATF, Iike my agency, is badly understaffed. People quit or retire, and it takes the USG ages to replace them. I lost my only fiscal support person from my unit thirteen months ago, and I still cannot get an answer from HQS about when I can realistically expect a replacement. So while it’s fun to poke at the Democrats, or the Republicans, or the Libertarians, or to conjure up conspiracy theories, the truth is that ATF just doesn’t have enough people to grind out the forms, and of the people they do have, some work faster, some work slower, and most likely, some don’t work at all. All you can do is hope that your paperwork makes it to the guy or gal who works faster….

I'd like to ask a question to someone that has a little more background than most. Why do you think that we are seeing plenty of 60-90 day form 4 approvals all of the sudden? It obviously strikes a chord with a lot of people who have been waiting 200+ days. Seems logical to start at the back of the stack and work forward but there has to be a reason. Thanks!

 

[ScreamingPotato]

I'd like to ask a question to someone that has a little more background than most. Why do you think that we are seeing plenty of 60-90 day form 4 approvals all of the sudden? It obviously strikes a chord with a lot of people who have been waiting 200+ days. Seems logical to start at the back of the stack and work forward but there has to be a reason. Thanks!

I know you're not asking me, but some people have a lot more life history to investigate. Speaking for certain clearances for example we had a guy at work that took 1.5 years and still never got approved or rejected so he finally got fired. That guy was a contractor who had about 80 different jobs in the prior 5 or so years. I don't know if it applies to the suppressor background checks but for the clearances each job or history item is verified I believe. Same thing with the local PD, the detectives will verify everything and physically visit prior employers and such for interviews for potential candidates. It doesn't take long for a kid out of high school, but a 35 year old with an extensive job history will take longer. Again I have no idea if it applies to our form 4's or if it's even that in-depth, but seems like some reddit nerd in college who's never had a job doesn't have a lot to follow up on, whereas a 55 year old may have more that needs to be verified and some of that may be waiting on responses from people.

 

[Bluefish]

I know you're not asking me, but some people have a lot more life history to investigate. Speaking for certain clearances for example we had a guy at work that took 1.5 years and still never got approved or rejected so he finally got fired. That guy was a contractor who had about 80 different jobs in the prior 5 or so years. I don't know if it applies to the suppressor background checks but for the clearances each job or history item is verified I believe. Same thing with the local PD, the detectives will verify everything and physically visit prior employers and such for interviews for potential candidates. It doesn't take long for a kid out of high school, but a 35 year old with an extensive job history will take longer.

Considering I and probably a lot of others already have nfa items, why should it take so long? Especially when I am seeing approvals from weeks to months after my oldest submission.

 

[ScreamingPotato]

Considering I and probably a lot of others already have nfa items, why should it take so long? Especially when I am seeing approvals from weeks to months after my oldest submission.

Because it's the government.

They're probably doing a whole new background with each one, because... it's the government. lol

 

[5811]

Because it's the government.

They're probably doing a whole new background with each one, because... it's the government. lol

If it took 240 days for everyone, everyone would complain. If it takes half of the people 120 days and the other half 360, only half the people complain.

 

[SloppyJ]

If it took 240 days for everyone, everyone would complain. If it takes half of the people 120 days and the other half 360, only half the people complain.

True but just make it make sense. It seems to me they're padding their stats since enough people have been bringing it up in congress. It's all BS anyway. Why in the world is a suppressor a NFA item? Why is 16" the determining factor for a pistol? Just a bunch of arbitrary crap that was probably at one point a good intention but far from it now.

 

[ScreamingPotato]

True but just make it make sense. It seems to me they're padding their stats since enough people have been bringing it up in congress. It's all BS anyway. Why in the world is a suppressor a NFA item? Why is 16" the determining factor for a pistol? Just a bunch of arbitrary crap that was probably at one point a good intention but far from it now.

It's absurd. If you have to have anything just make it a regular instant background check. These peckerheads have seen way too many assassin movies.

 

[Dave C.]

Well, as promised, checking back in on SC process:

Wednesday 8/9 approval (overnight). Did paperwork immediately and signed before 8am the next morning. Local LE mail notification was delivered on 8/14. I emailed SC for a status update and got a response on 8/15 saying the earliest they could ship to the in state FFL would be 8/21 (ie 7D from notification). I sent another note and called on 8/23 asking for an update (I got no response from SC), and got tracking information on Friday 8/25 that is was leaving SD and headed to MT. It was delivered on 8/28 to MT FFL, then today 2nd mailing from FFL to my house for delivery Thursday, 8/31 or ~3 weeks after approval.

I've been pretty unimpressed with their process post approval. It's crazy it takes an entire week from when they COULD ship it to when they did to in-state FFL. Whoever at SC is telling people they mail to in-state FFL while awaiting LE response is either wrong, or they suck at their process. Either way, shouldn't be that hard to que packages in piles based on permitted ship date for pickup. They may not do that b/c they don't want chances for the process to break down and having something ship out that should not, and breaking whatever special agreement they have with ATF? Who knows.

Anyone ordering from SC should expect 3 week min wait for delivery after approval based on my experience. I expected about a 2 week delay as a convenience trade off, but whatever. I'd tell anyone consisdering using them that they indeed make it turn key, will let you lay away the suppressor into 4 monthly payments at 0%, they make the paperwork a breeze, they really suffer on the CS front (must be scaling and overloading all their people), they are slow as hell on the backend, and literally mail it straight to you, albiet in 2-steps. Whether or not that is worth it, or okay for an individual is entirely up to them. From what I gather, there's some other paths that are almost as easy and much quicker post-approval. That's my SC experience.

Hate to say "I told you so," but....

Hopefully, those truly wanting accurate and truthful information to guide their decision will take note. If you don't mind unnecessarily adding up to a month or more to your wait time then, by all means, buy from SC. Just don't say nobody warned you that they lie and have terrible CS.

 

[Marshfly]

That story about Silencer Central is wild. My suppressor purchased from Silencer Shop has been sitting at my local FFL since a couple of weeks after I started the process. When I get the approval, I will simply drive over there and get it.

 

[5811]

Well, as promised, checking back in on SC process:

Wednesday 8/9 approval (overnight). Did paperwork immediately and signed before 8am the next morning. Local LE mail notification was delivered on 8/14. I emailed SC for a status update and got a response on 8/15 saying the earliest they could ship to the in state FFL would be 8/21 (ie 7D from notification). I sent another note and called on 8/23 asking for an update (I got no response from SC), and got tracking information on Friday 8/25 that is was leaving SD and headed to MT. It was delivered on 8/28 to MT FFL, then today 2nd mailing from FFL to my house for delivery Thursday, 8/31 or ~3 weeks after approval.

I've been pretty unimpressed with their process post approval. It's crazy it takes an entire week from when they COULD ship it to when they did to in-state FFL. Whoever at SC is telling people they mail to in-state FFL while awaiting LE response is either wrong, or they suck at their process. Either way, shouldn't be that hard to que packages in piles based on permitted ship date for pickup. They may not do that b/c they don't want chances for the process to break down and having something ship out that should not, and breaking whatever special agreement they have with ATF? Who knows.

Anyone ordering from SC should expect 3 week min wait for delivery after approval based on my experience. I expected about a 2 week delay as a convenience trade off, but whatever. I'd tell anyone consisdering using them that they indeed make it turn key, will let you lay away the suppressor into 4 monthly payments at 0%, they make the paperwork a breeze, they really suffer on the CS front (must be scaling and overloading all their people), they are slow as hell on the backend, and literally mail it straight to you, albiet in 2-steps. Whether or not that is worth it, or okay for an individual is entirely up to them. From what I gather, there's some other paths that are almost as easy and much quicker post-approval. That's my SC experience.

I reached out to SC once previously to see if I could request that this was done ahead of time. I was told they would look into it, so I reached out again to see if it was possible. The response from SC customer service was:

"I see a note on your account that reached out previously about doing the CLEO before approval. We are unable to do this however with the current work flow we have we are able to get the CLEOs out in 24 hours if not same day after the 4473 Transfer form is complete. We send the notice out as certified mail so once it is marked delivered the 7 calendar day wait starts. Once day 7 is upon us our shipping team starts getting things ready to go so we can send you tracking information

We are federally required to make this notice after approval due to shipping across state lines to our customers. Until approval is given we have no information to provide to the sheriffs office and that is why we wait."

Is there any truth to this, that they can't do it ahead of time? How does SS and CA do it?

 

[HandgunHTR]

I reached out to SC once previously to see if I could request that this was done ahead of time. I was told they would look into it, so I reached out again to see if it was possible. The response from SC customer service was:

"I see a note on your account that reached out previously about doing the CLEO before approval. We are unable to do this however with the current work flow we have we are able to get the CLEOs out in 24 hours if not same day after the 4473 Transfer form is complete. We send the notice out as certified mail so once it is marked delivered the 7 calendar day wait starts. Once day 7 is upon us our shipping team starts getting things ready to go so we can send you tracking information

We are federally required to make this notice after approval due to shipping across state lines to our customers. Until approval is given we have no information to provide to the sheriffs office and that is why we wait."

Is there any truth to this, that they can't do it ahead of time? How does SS and CA do it?

That is bullshit. They aren’t shipping it directly to you. They are shipping it to a dealer in your state via a Form 3 (another thing that adds time to the process, but no way around that, even for SS). They are giving misleading information. Yes, you are federally required to do the CLEO notification. No, it doesn’t have to be done after approval. Link to the actual law is above somewhere.

All the notification requires is the name and address of the transferee (trust or individual name), and what is being transferred. All information that is on the Form 4.

I feel it important to add that I have no personal vendetta against SC. I have never used them. I have purchased all of my suppressors from Silencer Shop and Capitol Armory.
I do, however have beef with people who feel the need to go above and beyond what the law requires for some stupid reason. This is how we end up with expanded laws, like universal background checks and other crap. Lawmakers see this crap and say, “see they are already doing it, so let’s just make it law.”

 

[armedhiker]

Just got mine yesterday and it took right around 11 months give or take a few days.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

All that pain and suffering just to get a banish 30 when you could have gotten something better.

 

[Dave C.]

I reached out to SC once previously to see if I could request that this was done ahead of time. I was told they would look into it, so I reached out again to see if it was possible. The response from SC customer service was:

"I see a note on your account that reached out previously about doing the CLEO before approval. We are unable to do this however with the current work flow we have we are able to get the CLEOs out in 24 hours if not same day after the 4473 Transfer form is complete. We send the notice out as certified mail so once it is marked delivered the 7 calendar day wait starts. Once day 7 is upon us our shipping team starts getting things ready to go so we can send you tracking information

We are federally required to make this notice after approval due to shipping across state lines to our customers. Until approval is given we have no information to provide to the sheriffs office and that is why we wait."

Is there any truth to this, that they can't do it ahead of time? How does SS and CA do it?

This is a 100% lie, plain and simple. I have reviewed the regulations and there is absolutely NOTHING that states this is the requirement. I even asked them to provide me with the regulation or "opinion" from ATF stating this. They couldn't do it. It's complete and total B.S. made up by their attorneys or mgmt to save the cost of a few stamps.

 

[5811]

This is a 100% lie, plain and simple. I have reviewed the regulations and there is absolutely NOTHING that states this is the requirement. I even asked them to provide me with the regulation or "opinion" from ATF stating this. They couldn't do it. It's complete and total B.S. made up by their attorneys or mgmt to save the cost of a few stamps.

The cost savings is the certified letter plus the time/wages to draft the notice, so its a little more than a stamp. My favorite sneaky part of their message was the bit where they subtly say they won't even begin preparing it for shipment until after day 7. Another possible savings if the CLEO protests.

Either way, I will not tolerate being lied to. They have lost my business in the future.

All that pain and suffering just to get a banish 30 when you could have gotten something better.

100 percent true. And cheaper. It all started here on rokslide for me. I read about how bad muzzle brakes were for hearing loss, panicked, googled best .30 cal suppressor, found some puff piece that said SC and the Banish 30 were the best, saw how easy they make it, and jumped in. I looked at wait times and thought I could have it by deer season.

Only afterwards did I start my real research. I urge anyone reading this that is on the fence to skip Silencer Central and look real hard at Diligent Defense. Hundreds cheaper, lighter, and better sound suppression. And find a local shop to do the paperwork!

 

[thinhorn_AK]

The cost savings is the certified letter plus the time/wages to draft the notice, so its a little more than a stamp. My favorite sneaky part of their message was the bit where they subtly say they won't even begin preparing it for shipment until after day 7. Another possible savings if the CLEO protests.

Either way, I will not tolerate being lied to. They have lost my business in the future.



100 percent true. And cheaper. It all started here on rokslide for me. I read about how bad muzzle brakes were for hearing loss, panicked, googled best .30 cal suppressor, found some puff piece that said SC and the Banish 30 were the best, saw how easy they make it, and jumped in. I looked at wait times and thought I could have it by deer season.

Only afterwards did I start my real research. I urge anyone reading this that is on the fence to skip Silencer Central and look real hard at Diligent Defense. Hundreds cheaper, lighter, and better sound suppression. And find a local shop to do the paperwork!

I don’t know about diligent defense but a banish 30 was my first silencer. I tried to tell myself it was as good as anything else out there. I got an ultra 7 a few weeks ago and the fact of the matter is that it he hype is true, the ultra 7 is lighter, quieter, nicer and just flat out better all around.

I’ll still use my banish since I have it but I’d never recdomend one to anybody at this point with all the other options out there. In fact, I think I paid 25.00 more for my ultra 7 than I paid for the banish 30.

With that in mind though, I like my banish 22 better than my dead air mask 22. The mask 22 is very nice but the banish is ~ 30% lighter, full titanium so it’s easier to clean and seems to be just as quiet (which dosent really matter when I’m using cci quiet ammo).

 

[PlumberED]

Hello all. I am a very long time lurker and very infrequent poster, but I do feel a need to mention something here. I work for the USG and have extensive experience with background investigations, security clearances, etc. Just so folks know, holding any kind of USG security clearance is irrelevant to the background check associated with purchasing firearms and/or suppressors. The databases that are searched for firearms and/or suppressor purchases do not, in any way, interface with the USG’s databases where security clearances are maintained. It makes me kinda crazy when I hear LGS sales people state that approvals or denials for a weapons sale is somehow related to the customer having or not having a security clearance. If this was true, people with TS/SCIs would be approved much faster because they are subjected to “continuous vetting” as part of holding that clearance, and Uncle Sam pretty much knows what they are up to versus the Average Joe. I speak from experience here. I have had to wait about the average amount of time for all of my suppressor purchases.

Coming from the perspective of a USG supervisor in an agency that regularly interfaces with ATF the reality is that ATF, Iike my agency, is badly understaffed. People quit or retire, and it takes the USG ages to replace them. I lost my only fiscal support person from my unit thirteen months ago, and I still cannot get an answer from HQS about when I can realistically expect a replacement. So while it’s fun to poke at the Democrats, or the Republicans, or the Libertarians, or to conjure up conspiracy theories, the truth is that ATF just doesn’t have enough people to grind out the forms, and of the people they do have, some work faster, some work slower, and most likely, some don’t work at all. All you can do is hope that your paperwork makes it to the guy or gal who works faster….

Thank you for sharing your insight. Not to get political, just making an observation, it would seem as though this part of they ATF is woefully under funded and staffed.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I reached out to SC once previously to see if I could request that this was done ahead of time. I was told they would look into it, so I reached out again to see if it was possible. The response from SC customer service was:

"I see a note on your account that reached out previously about doing the CLEO before approval. We are unable to do this however with the current work flow we have we are able to get the CLEOs out in 24 hours if not same day after the 4473 Transfer form is complete. We send the notice out as certified mail so once it is marked delivered the 7 calendar day wait starts. Once day 7 is upon us our shipping team starts getting things ready to go so we can send you tracking information

We are federally required to make this notice after approval due to shipping across state lines to our customers. Until approval is given we have no information to provide to the sheriffs office and that is why we wait."

Is there any truth to this, that they can't do it ahead of time? How does SS and CA do it?

The only thing that changes is approved or denied.

They have all other pertinent info about the transferee and NFA item to notify.

I don’t know if they wait until it’s approved before submitting so they don’t submit a submission that may be denied but I would assume those are extremely rare.

Not defending SC because I’ve read enough terrible reviews that I will never purchase from them. I also have both Silencer Shop and Capitol Armory in my home state.


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[Nwegeleben]

Mine were approved in July. 8.5 months wait through silencer central

 

[gabenzeke]

Thank you for sharing your insight. Not to get political, just making an observation, it would seem as though this part of they ATF is woefully under funded and staffed.

On a podcast when e-file started back up they explained the ATF had a total of twelve people for this work.

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