Broadheads consistently hitting left of FP, regardless of moving rest

[TheCougar]

I’m looking for other options to fix an issue of broadheads hitting left of FP. I know part of the problem is hand torque on the shot, but there is also something else going on. I’m 10” left of my FP at 50 yards. If I have a “perfect” release and follow through, it will be 8” to the left. No matter how much I move my rest, the FP and broadheads never come together. My arrow spine should be good - BEA Spartans 300 spine, 125gr heads with insert weight, nock bushing and 3 x AAE Stealth Max vanes. Carbon to carbon length is around 27.5 inches. 29” draw and 78# pull off a Prime Centergy Hybrid.

I’m experimenting with my grip to see if there is something else going on. I’m very consistent and precise with my groups otherwise, but I can’t bring them together. I’m also going to throw on a 100 grain head and see if that changes anything. I haven’t paper tuned in a long time, but I had a nock right paper tear last year. I walk back tuned with FP and had it perfect.

you guys have any suggestions for changing my grip or tweaking other things on the bow to fix this?

 

[Ucsdryder]

You’re underspined by a decent amount. Try turning your bow down to 70lb and putting a 100gr point. How much insert weight? Also try cranking the flexis tight vs letting out 3 turns. Once you’ve done the other 2 steps.

 

[Zac]

What type of head are you using?

 

[Brendan]

Agree that you look underspined. I'd test that, and also while you're at it check for fletching contact. That's easy and will have you chasing your tail if you don't fix it before any other tuning.

 

[RaggedHunter]

One thing to try, it may sound silly but try rotating the nock on your broadhead arrow and re shooting, do this a couple times. It may yield no results, but several times I have seen this hit a sweet spot with the spine and bring those broadheads in to the filed points a little. Otherwise if this doesn't help, I have to agree with others sounds like an underspine issue.

 

[Ucsdryder]

I got ahead of myself. Have you spun your Broadheads and shafts? Everyone always assumes they’re spinning well but make sure. I had a fixed blade that wouldn’t hit with field points. I spun it and it had a wobble. Swapped it out and it brought it right in.

 

[Terrapin]

One other thing to consider is that it could be riser flex or limb twist. You would be amazed at how much risers move in relation to the grip as you draw the bow back... especially at higher poundages. This movement is not just in the direction of the draw stroke, the limb pockets also move to the right and left, and in different amounts between the two pockets. Considering riser flex, and lateral nock travel caused by limb twist, and it’s amazing we ever get a bow to tune. I just say this to acknowledge that some bows may never shoot broadheads and field points to the same group.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[5MilesBack]

If you want to see what your grip changes do for your arrows, shoot bare shafts with your fletched at 20 yards. It's amazing what impact your grip has on your arrows, and it's much easier to see that with BS's. And you don't tear up your target as much. Really force the grip changes, like twisting left, and then twisting right and see which direction you need to go. Then when you get your BS's and fletched together perfectly parallel, then try your BH's again.

Also, have you tried moving your rest in both directions? What rest are you using?

 

[2Stamp]

You're a little underspinned. Dropping that bow to 70 with that arrow you're about right, or changing to a 100 gr tip at the poundage will stiffen your spin a bit also. Have you shot a bareshaft with your fletched arrows to see how they group? Also, as said above, have you used the flexis arm in any of your tuning? I shoot that same bow, but at 70# (and a regular Centergy also at 70#).

 

[406unltd]

Sounds like you need more head weight or poundage due to being overspined. If that’s not a option you are interested in, new arrows with a weaker spine would help/ and or same spine arrow you have but longer overall length.

 

[rclouse79]

Same story for me last year. Switched to a much stiffer arrow this off season and wallah.

 

[Brendan]

Sounds like you need more head weight or poundage due to being overspined. If that’s not a option you are interested in, new arrows with a weaker spine would help/ and or same spine arrow you have but longer overall length.

Backwards. Definitely NOT overspined with that setup.

 

[406unltd]

I think I’m must have missed something. Is he left handed?

Backwards. Definitely NOT overspined with that setup.

 

[Brendan]

That graphic is a pretty old one, and disagrees with many better pieces of advice. There's a lot wrong with it. Go watch the Gold Tip super tuning series with Gillingham for a much better reference.

Think about it. He's shooting an 80# bow, 29" draw, 300 spine arrows. Too stiff would disagree with every program and every spine chart in existence.

I've also owned the exact bow, 70 and 80# limbs, same draw length, and have experimented with both 260 and 300 spine arrows at different draw weights.


Edit: Gold Tip Spine Video. The whole series is worth watching.

 

[NYSKIER]

If you want to see what your grip changes do for your arrows, shoot bare shafts with your fletched at 20 yards. It's amazing what impact your grip has on your arrows, and it's much easier to see that with BS's. And you don't tear up your target as much. Really force the grip changes, like twisting left, and then twisting right and see which direction you need to go. Then when you get your BS's and fletched together perfectly parallel, then try your BH's again.

Also, have you tried moving your rest in both directions? What rest are you using?

I agree with this 100% I can clear up most if not all issues with a good ole fashioned bareshaft session

 

[TheCougar]

First off, thank you to everyone who has offered ideas. I'm not 100% sure its a mechanical problem or a shooter problem, or both! I'm going to test a number of things to try and narrow it down. When I get home I will double check a few things and send pictures of my grip and shooting posture. Going down the list of suggestions:

1. Arrow spine: the consensus seems to be that I am underspined. I'm not convinced of this - I built these arrows using Archer's Advantage (no longer have a subscription, however) and they were properly spined on the program. Perhaps that doesn't translate to the real world. When I get back, I will check my not book and update my original post with the exact numbers for my setup.

2. Flexis: This thing is Voodoo to me. I believe it is about 2 1/2 turns from fully tightened, but I will go back and check.

3. Broadheads and Shafts: QAD Exodus and Slick Trick Magnums. All my broadheads and shafts have been spun and they are true. The results are identical for all the shafts I try and for multiple heads. All my shafts have the dynamic spine marked and the cock vane is in line with the dynamic spine. I'm pretty anal about my setup, so if there is an error, it will at least be a consistent error!

4. Rest: Hamskea Hybrid Hunter Limb Drawn. I've tested for contact multiple times and come up negative, nor are there any indications (wear marks, etc) on the vanes or the bow. I have tried moving the rest on both directions.

In an effort to answer all the excellent inputs, when I get home I will test out the following and send pictures:

1. Grip and posture - perhaps there is something there that you will see.
2. Spine: I'll post up my exact numbers and put on a 100gr head to see if that makes a difference.
3. Flexis: I'll adjust the Flexis and put pictures of the results up.
4. I'll try to post up a picture of the papertune, if I can rig one up quickly tonight.
5. Bareshafts - I'll try bareshafts and my BH post up pictures.

Again, I appreciate all the help!

You’re underspined by a decent amount. Try turning your bow down to 70lb and putting a 100gr point. How much insert weight? Also try cranking the flexis tight vs letting out 3 turns. Once you’ve done the other 2 steps.

What type of head are you using?

Agree that you look underspined. I'd test that, and also while you're at it check for fletching contact. That's easy and will have you chasing your tail if you don't fix it before any other tuning.

One thing to try, it may sound silly but try rotating the nock on your broadhead arrow and re shooting, do this a couple times. It may yield no results, but several times I have seen this hit a sweet spot with the spine and bring those broadheads in to the filed points a little. Otherwise if this doesn't help, I have to agree with others sounds like an underspine issue.

One other thing to consider is that it could be riser flex or limb twist. You would be amazed at how much risers move in relation to the grip as you draw the bow back... especially at higher poundages. This movement is not just in the direction of the draw stroke, the limb pockets also move to the right and left, and in different amounts between the two pockets. Considering riser flex, and lateral nock travel caused by limb twist, and it’s amazing we ever get a bow to tune. I just say this to acknowledge that some bows may never shoot broadheads and field points to the same group.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you want to see what your grip changes do for your arrows, shoot bare shafts with your fletched at 20 yards. It's amazing what impact your grip has on your arrows, and it's much easier to see that with BS's. And you don't tear up your target as much. Really force the grip changes, like twisting left, and then twisting right and see which direction you need to go. Then when you get your BS's and fletched together perfectly parallel, then try your BH's again.

Also, have you tried moving your rest in both directions? What rest are you using?

You're a little underspinned. Dropping that bow to 70 with that arrow you're about right, or changing to a 100 gr tip at the poundage will stiffen your spin a bit also. Have you shot a bareshaft with your fletched arrows to see how they group? Also, as said above, have you used the flexis arm in any of your tuning? I shoot that same bow, but at 70# (and a regular Centergy also at 70#).

Sounds like you need more head weight or poundage due to being overspined. If that’s not a option you are interested in, new arrows with a weaker spine would help/ and or same spine arrow you have but longer overall length.

Same story for me last year. Switched to a much stiffer arrow this off season and wallah.

 

[Brendan]

First off, thank you to everyone who has offered ideas. I'm not 100% sure its a mechanical problem or a shooter problem, or both! I'm going to test a number of things to try and narrow it down. When I get home I will double check a few things and send pictures of my grip and shooting posture. Going down the list of suggestions:

1. Arrow spine: the consensus seems to be that I am underspined. I'm not convinced of this - I built these arrows using Archer's Advantage (no longer have a subscription, however) and they were properly spined on the program. Perhaps that doesn't translate to the real world. When I get back, I will check my not book and update my original post with the exact numbers for my setup.

You could be okay, but not sure I agree with AA. I think at the least you'll be borderline weak, although you might get it to tune. Easy to test though, and rule out fletching contact too.

Here's Pinwheel SFAX, assuming a 20 grain insert (it'll be worse if you're running something like a 50 grain brass). May have a couple things a little off, but I ran almost the same setup.

 

[Billy Goat]

First off, thank you to everyone who has offered ideas. I'm not 100% sure its a mechanical problem or a shooter problem, or both! I'm going to test a number of things to try and narrow it down. When I get home I will double check a few things and send pictures of my grip and shooting posture. Going down the list of suggestions:

1. Arrow spine: the consensus seems to be that I am underspined. I'm not convinced of this - I built these arrows using Archer's Advantage (no longer have a subscription, however) and they were properly spined on the program. Perhaps that doesn't translate to the real world. When I get back, I will check my not book and update my original post with the exact numbers for my setup.

2. Flexis: This thing is Voodoo to me. I believe it is about 2 1/2 turns from fully tightened, but I will go back and check.

3. Broadheads and Shafts: QAD Exodus and Slick Trick Magnums. All my broadheads and shafts have been spun and they are true. The results are identical for all the shafts I try and for multiple heads. All my shafts have the dynamic spine marked and the cock vane is in line with the dynamic spine. I'm pretty anal about my setup, so if there is an error, it will at least be a consistent error!

4. Rest: Hamskea Hybrid Hunter Limb Drawn. I've tested for contact multiple times and come up negative, nor are there any indications (wear marks, etc) on the vanes or the bow. I have tried moving the rest on both directions.

In an effort to answer all the excellent inputs, when I get home I will test out the following and send pictures:

1. Grip and posture - perhaps there is something there that you will see.
2. Spine: I'll post up my exact numbers and put on a 100gr head to see if that makes a difference.
3. Flexis: I'll adjust the Flexis and put pictures of the results up.
4. I'll try to post up a picture of the papertune, if I can rig one up quickly tonight.
5. Bareshafts - I'll try bareshafts and my BH post up pictures.

Again, I appreciate all the help!

Something I have done is backed off the limb bolts to test spine. Mark the bolts where they are, turn them back out 1.5-2 turns. Shoot and see if your broadheads aren't with your field points, if they are start to tighten them down 1/4 turn at a time until they seperate again.

I suspect it's a combination of factors, just remember when you change one thing everything changes, so make sure you only adjust one thing at a time. And keep a notebook of what you are doing and the results.

 

[TheCougar]

You could be okay, but not sure I agree with AA. I think at the least you'll be borderline weak, although you might get it to tune. Easy to test though, and rule out fletching contact too.

Here's Pinwheel SFAX, assuming a 20 grain insert (it'll be worse if you're running something like a 50 grain brass). May have a couple things a little off, but I ran almost the same setup.

View attachment 176210

I'm not familiar with Pinwheel, but thanks for looking into it. The numbers aren't accurate (my arrow weighs 482gr and it's right around 290fps). I'll get you the correct information when I get home. I've got a notebook that I keep all the raw numbers in.

 

[TheCougar]

Something I have done is backed off the limb bolts to test spine. Mark the bolts where they are, turn them back out 1.5-2 turns. Shoot and see if your broadheads aren't with your field points, if they are start to tighten them down 1/4 turn at a time until they seperate again.

I suspect it's a combination of factors, just remember when you change one thing everything changes, so make sure you only adjust one thing at a time. And keep a notebook of what you are doing and the results.

I was planning on just swapping a 100 gr broadhead rather than turn down the limb bolts. Do you think that will be suffcient?