high fence whitetail

[signing off]

is this a comment about HF or managed private land thats LF’ed?

I wanted to add how I enjoy hunting to the conversation. The theoretical HF hunt doesn't check all the boxes of why I hunt. I'm also at a financial point where 2-5k spent on a hunt would need to be justified by what is brought home.
After being an RMEF volunteer for 10+ years, I still have not cooked elk in my home. Guys are stingy with that stuff!!! And due to the effort and cost, I totally understand that.

 

[wind gypsy]

The 40-120 acre places are not majority or even a percentage point of acreage under fence, but Its defiantly the battle cry of those who hate it. I would call those places pens.

You're likely right especially in places like TX but the little places (less than say 300 acres) seem to be the only ones I have ever heard about here in MN.

 

[wind gypsy]

I wanted to add how I enjoy hunting to the conversation. The theoretical HF hunt doesn't check all the boxes of why I hunt. I'm also at a financial point where 2-5k spent on a hunt would need to be justified by what is brought home.
After being an RMEF volunteer for 10+ years, I still have not cooked elk in my home. Guys are stingy with that stuff!!! And due to the effort and cost, I totally understand that.

If 60 #'s of whitetail meat justifies $2-5k it seems you're able to perform sufficient mental gymnastics to justify coming home empty handed too,

 

[Shō[t]gun]

I've never high fence hunted and don't have a desire to. But, I wonder how much it compares to hunting over bait, or simply hunting a farm field, or shooting an animal from 1000 yds away.

There are a lot of methods that I'm not interested in, but if they are legal, it's not up to me to say it's ok or not.

There's a lot of ethical real estate between baiting free roaming deer and paying to shoot one in a prison.

 

[Shō[t]gun]

You make it sound like you cant buy a 400” elk or 200” whitetail or 200” mule deer on LF.

I'm well aware there are equivalents in western hunting, and those are equally deserving of criticism. People pay tens of thousands of dollars for access to certain private ranches where elk grow big and stupid. One of those on the wall is equally as unimpressive as a massive incarcerated whitetail rack. Its like the people who pose for pictures next to their bone-stock car, ok you bought it... good job?

 

[cuerro viejo]

There's a lot of ethical real estate between baiting free roaming deer and paying to shoot one in a prison.

is there? If a WT’s core and home range is well in side the given area, whats the difference?

Ill be the first to admit there is the ability to get acreage small enough that it restricts daily and yearling movement, but if it doesnt it doesnt.

 

[cuerro viejo]

I'm well aware there are equivalents in western hunting, and those are equally deserving of criticism. People pay tens of thousands of dollars for access to certain private ranches where elk grow big and stupid. One of those on the wall is equally as unimpressive as a massive incarcerated whitetail rack. Its like the people who pose for pictures next to their bone-stock car, ok you bought it... good job?

I was looking for you to define your motivators, and now you have.

Its not about ethics, Biology, herd health, ecosystem, development protection, sustainability, etc simply about money. All private property and reservations fall under the same category, its money.

 

[MuleyFever]

I will just say that if HF didn't offer something more then people like OP wouldn't be seeking it out. To say its the same as fair chase is just not true on any scale. HF is about control and that may be population or trophy size but that control creates a different environment. Again, if it didn't then people wouldn't ask for it, or pay for it.

 

[Shō[t]gun]

I was looking for you to define your motivators, and now you have.

Its not about ethics, Biology, herd health, ecosystem, development protection, sustainability, etc simply about money. All private property and reservations fall under the same category, its money.

Not much of a revelation, that was brought up in the first couple posts. When an animal becomes a commodity and is sold to the highest bidder, then yeah I don’t see why that should be celebrated. There are plenty of ways to be a conservationist to the land without putting up a huge fence and selling pet deer for people to show off.

 

[johnnycake]

When I was a teen, my dad and I got invited down to South Texas to hunt does, hogs, and javelina on a friend's HF ranch. We thought it was going to be a walk in the park. High fence, baiting with corn? How hard could it be?

Holy shit it was a lot more challenging than we expected. The place was about 5500 acres all in one high fence, with 3 strand barb wire separating certain sections. The brush was hellacious. The deer were every bit as spooky as the whitetails we chased in PA. They didn't truck in deer or shoot the bucks up with hormones. Best buck we saw might have been a 140-150" 12pt. Those hogs were not stopped by the fence either. We did managed to shoot some does, hogs and a javelina throughout the week and they let me shoot a small cull buck at one point. We left that week with a very different opinion than when we arrived. Sure, not every place is run the same, and it's not my first choice for an adventure, but I'd be lying if I didn't say it was a fun time and more challenging than expected.

 

[CMP70306]

Then inform us please. What’s the attraction of a high dollar menu hunt?

For me I went on a high fence hunt in Nebraska for bison, it offered what I wanted which was an opportunity to take a bison with my Sharps. The bison were left to their own devices in a 4,000 acre pasture and the only time anyone interacted with them was to kill one so they were pretty skittish around people. Additionally out of 200-300 bison only 10 to 15 were the big bulls I was there to hunt, plenty of additional eyes that made getting close difficult. It took me a day and a half and 7 different stalks on multiple groups of bison to get close enough for a 120 yard shot so it was by no means an easy hunt. If I was interested in killing them at 300 yards with a scoped rifle then it definitely would have been much easier.

My alternative was spend decades applying for a dwindling number of NR tags to the handful of places that still have wild herds. That includes hunting Montana which are the bison that wander out of Yellowstone which after going there last year would have been substantially easier to kill than the bison I did hunt.

 

[IdahoBeav]

Can't come on here and talk HF or bait or dog hunting without a thick skin.

So many hunters have strong opinions about stuff. They think that whatever they do is the best and only way to do stuff.

That's because western hunting snobs are a pain in the ass. There will always be a way to say that one hunt was more challenging or sporting than another. These guys that cry about dogs/bait/fences/etc. will gladly take a rifle elk rut tag or sit a wallow on a prime elk ranch. Partake in what you enjoy and pass on what you don't, but there is no reason to endlessly whine about how others spend money and kill animals.

 

[Elkangle]

I think HF should employ some good mental calisthenics on what one is after...Every single hunter admitted or not wants to be the only one on the landscape, with big healthy animals that aren't so spooky that you have a reasonable chance if harvest in a reasonable amount of time...special permit units put up a restricted fence of tags on a given area(sometimes on 1) , back country puts up a fence of physical limitations on a given area, weapons restrictions puts up a fence of skills... and don't kid yourself you "pay" for all of them ! HF just puts the price up front...it puts everything up front and in your face of what the hunter is after. Obviously some hunters are on the gross end of the spectrum shooting animals in cages but I've been told 1st hand accounts that I trust, that as little as 200 acres is enough to create a very challenging atmosphere which blows my mind. Never underestimate deer

Now I've never participated in highfence, but after getting my teeth kicked in on loads of different hunts each year we often joke about how it sounds pretty dang nice to be able to sleep in, hit the hot tub with a morning cocktail and then have a butler bring out the rifle when that 430 bull walks across the lawn at 450 yards completely unaware.. but this seems much more of a delusional, dehydrated, sleep deprived fantasy then reality. But gosh dang it sure sounds nice and in some way if ever participated in... earned

 

[RCB]

How is this thread even real? Dude politely asks for advice and now we have to give him a hard time? Jesus

 

[wind gypsy]

is there? If a WT’s core and home range is well in side the given area, whats the difference?

Ill be the first to admit there is the ability to get acreage small enough that it restricts daily and yearling movement, but if it doesnt it doesnt.

The ability of a whitetail to leave it's core area if people trying to kill it cause it to do so or the fact that core areas are controlled by a fence in the first place.

 

[Mike D Texas]

Lol let’s not get started on Africa. But Texas has a lot similarities as far as availability of game and public land opportunities. It’s unappealing to me because it looks like a product more than a unique unknown experience. If I go to CO and hosed by the weather not pushing the elk where I planned, I feel like I learned something and nature drew the better card. If I paid a ton of money for access to 200+” deer and don’t see a single one, I’d feel like I got swindled.

I can understand that.

High fence hunting isn’t for everyone.

But to speak negatively of (all of) them just because you don’t have a desire to hunt them or you read or saw a show on a shitty HF operation is not cool.

That’s not necessarily directed at you but the general attitude about HF hunting on here in general.


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[Yoder]

I don't care how anyone hunts. If that's what you want to do and have the money, good for you. If the property was big enough, it could still be challenging to kill a big buck, especially with a bow. What doesn't interest me at all is hunting over a feeder. I'm not saying it's wrong, It's just not my idea of a hunt. I took my boys on a pig hunt years ago when they were pretty young and we sat over feeders. We had a lot of fun. It just wasn't hunting to me, my kids thought it was awesome.

 

[cuerro viejo]

The ability of a whitetail to leave it's core area if people trying to kill it cause it to do so or the fact that core areas are controlled by a fence in the first place.

10k is 15 section
6k is 9 sections
3k is 4.6 sections

Home area of mature buck 1.25-2
sections, Core <1 section

Biggest thing is No animal runs to a deterrent and just stop's.

obviously the bigger the property the less intrusive, but habitat can make small property bigger. Denser the cover etc

 

[cuerro viejo]

Not much of a revelation, that was brought up in the first couple posts. When an animal becomes a commodity and is sold to the highest bidder, then yeah I don’t see why that should be celebrated. There are plenty of ways to be a conservationist to the land without putting up a huge fence and selling pet deer for people to show off.

You mean like states having two different elk tag prices? one for quality, one for standard unit? What about Min number of paid for PP before you are even eligible to draw in a “random”

This isnt about conservation or fence by your definition its that people have the ability to buy land.

If I owned a big ranch and posted my deer LF or HF you would have same argument, difference is I would have spent exponentially more than any paid hunter per animal. So Im worse than them. I paid millions to hunt.

 

[wind gypsy]

10k is 15 section
6k is 9 sections
3k is 4.6 sections

Home area of mature buck 1.25-2
sections, Core <1 section

Biggest thing is No animal runs to a deterrent and just stop's.

obviously the bigger the property the less intrusive, but habitat can make small property bigger. Denser the cover etc

What is your point? 3k acres is roughly 3x the size of bucks home range that means the fence is real likely to impact where most bucks set up a home range. Dispersal would be significantly impacted vs not having a high fence. If it wasn't people wouldn't be spending over a half million $ to build a fence for such a place.

That causes at least 8.6 miles of fence blocking wildlife from natural movement. Not just owner of HF but for all of the owner's neighbors as well.