I keep reading about these bulls people are tagging and not finding....

[Gila]

I bet maybe 5% of hunters out there take hunting seriously and put in time and effort necessary to make consistent clean and ethical shots. Those should be the ones who respect the animals enough to punch the tag on a wounded unrecovered animal.

If that was the case, we wouldn't be on this forum because hunting would have been outlawed along time ago. I think that a thread like this could be a good reminder to us all to evaluate our ehthics and to review tactics to be better hunters. Unfortunately because of mere conjecture and highly emotional opinion, this thread is degrading rapidly to the point of being ANTI-HUNTING.

 

[tdhanses]

It does seem generous but.... i guess I've talked to an awful lot of hunters in the field with similar stories of hitting an animal and never finding it.... I totally understand it happens though, twigs get in the way, animal spins last second, blood trail goes away (happened to me this year, luckily found the elk anyway), etc. I'm just wrapping my head around how often it actually does happen

That’s interesting I would say 90% of the people I talk to are frustrated and not coming back to an area because they didn’t see a single elk, this applies for guys that have hunted a few days to 2 weeks, most just aren’t patient or just are on a walk with a weapon.

Then you have to add in the guys that saw elk but never did get close.

I‘ve talked to very few that have actually released an arrow over the years. I’ve also helped blood trail for a few I’ve met out in the woods, I’d say most haven’t been recovered if like Ross said not found within 200 yards and usually it’s a bad shot or even clean miss because we never found blood.

I don’t think there are a large % of wounded game running around.

 

[Gerbdog]

If that was the case, we wouldn't be on this forum because hunting would have been outlawed along time ago. I think that a thread like this could be a good reminder to us all to evaluate our ehthics and to review tactics to be better hunters. Unfortunately because of mere conjecture and highly emotional opinion, this thread is degrading rapidly to the point of being ANTI-HUNTING.

I guess I started this thread because I was curious what the numbers on these wounded shots that never get recovered actually looked like. I agree with you:
"I think that a thread like this could be a good reminder to us all to evaluate our ehthics and to review tactics to be better hunters."
And was hoping that some folks had good tips for tracking wounded animals, as it seems to be a sore spot that many folks don't have a lot of experience with, myself included.
I certainly think people should be out hunting and learning but as stated... this thread is a good reminder to make sure you are practiced at the hunting tool of your choice and to make ethical shots

Also shout out to Socorro NM, I went to high school and NMT there, we probably crossed paths and I dunno if you know Tim but I learned to hunt under his tutelage. My first elk was on the eastern slope of the magdalenas with a muzzleloader

 

[Gila]

The scientific research on big game wounding rates, mostly done on whitetail deer, shows that about 15-20% of game hit are wounded and never recovered and about 85% of those wounded animals live.

That data is closer to what I would expect for bowhunting. It would be nice to see the data for each weapon type though.

 

[tdhanses]

Very true on a dog. Most tracking dogs will have no problem on a 16-24 hr trail as long as it’s not to disturbed by us, or extreme weather. A lot of Blood isn’t even necessary for many dogs. He’ll I brought mine to Wyoming just in case and boarded him in the near by town. A good resource to find a tracking dog is United blood trackers website.

I do believe this is illegal in most of the west, I’d research before just using a dog.

 

[Felix40]

That’s interesting I would say 90% of the people I talk to are frustrated and not coming back to an area because they didn’t see a single elk, this applies for guys that have hunted a few days to 2 weeks, most just aren’t patient or just are on a walk with a weapon.

Then you have to add in the guys that saw elk but never did get close.

I‘ve talked to very few that have actually released an arrow over the years. I’ve also helped blood trail for a few I’ve met out in the woods, I’d say most haven’t been recovered if like Ross said not found within 200 yards and usually it’s a bad shot or even clean miss because we never found blood.

I don’t think there are a large % of wounded game running around.

Thats definitely a different area than where I live. Around here it would be hard to not see elk even from the highway. I’m basing my opinion on contacting dozens of hunters a season in a high quality unit. It is not uncommon to contact guys with empty quivers who have shot at multiple elk that day. Things will definitely be different in different areas.

 

[Gila]

That’s interesting I would say 90% of the people I talk to are frustrated and not coming back to an area because they didn’t see a single elk, this applies for guys that have hunted a few days to 2 weeks, most just aren’t patient or just are on a walk with a weapon.

Then you have to add in the guys that saw elk but never did get close.

I‘ve talked to very few that have actually released an arrow over the years. I’ve also helped blood trail for a few I’ve met out in the woods, I’d say most haven’t been recovered if like Ross said not found within 200 yards and usually it’s a bad shot or even clean miss because we never found blood.

I don’t think there are a large % of wounded game running around.

100% of the people I talked to tagged their elk on opening day of the early bow season in the Gila. He was using a crossbow.
.

 

[tdhanses]

Thats definitely a different area than where I live. Around here it would be hard to not see elk even from the highway. I’m basing my opinion on contacting dozens of hunters a season in a high quality unit. It is not uncommon to contact guys with empty quivers who have shot at multiple elk that day. Things will definitely be different in different areas.

I think you should pm me the unit info so I can do my own independent test

 

[mavinwa2]

each of the last 3 years, I've come across dead bulls. From poorly placed shots, arrows.
the smell of death, birds-ravens, coyote(s) running off, coming across dried blood trails all led me to the dead bulls.

2019 Colorado: 2 dead bulls 3x4. 5x5, 1 dead cow. OTC SW unit. One bull had arrow out its ass. Like someone attempted a "Texas heart shot". The other bull shot in the paunch, ahead of rear quarter, back of last rib, pass thru.
2018: WA, 1 dead 5x5, 1 spike bull. Both gut shot, one still had "walmart arrow" sticking out.
2017: NM, no tag for me but I was out scouting DURING archery elk season. 6x6, one arrow in backstrap the other arrow fell out (as there was no pass thru hole on other side of arrow entry), but was paunch shot.

yeah, "stuff happens". Poor excuse, often used. The "stuff" should only happen <2% of the time on any archery shot!
as an archer, you owe it to the game pursued and to yourself to be DISCIPLINED TO TAKE THE GOOD SHOT OR NO SHOT.

edit: when I come across dead, lost game....it feels like a kick in the gut. Nearly ruins my day.
Especially to know there are people out there archery elk hunting WHO shouldn't be out there.

 

[Felix40]

I think you should pm me the unit info so I can do my own independent test

Hardest part of the hunt is drawing the tag.

Success rates hover around 35-40% every year.

 

[Gerbdog]

each of the last 3 years, I've come across dead bulls. From poorly placed shots, arrows.
the smell of death, birds-ravens, coyote(s) running off, coming across dried blood trails all led me to the dead bulls.

2019 Colorado: 2 dead bulls 3x4. 5x5, 1 dead cow. OTC SW unit. One bull had arrow out its ass. Like someone attempted a "Texas heart shot". The other bull shot in the paunch, ahead of rear quarter, back of last rib, pass thru.
2018: WA, 1 dead 5x5, 1 spike bull. Both gut shot, one still had "walmart arrow" sticking out.
2017: NM, no tag for me but I was out scouting DURING archery elk season. 6x6, one arrow in backstrap the other arrow fell out (as there was no pass thru hole on other side of arrow entry), but was paunch shot.

yeah, "stuff happens". Poor excuse, often used. The "stuff" should only happen 2% of the time on any archery shot!
as an archer, you owe it to the game pursued and to yourself to be DISCIPLINED TO TAKE THE GOOD SHOT OR NO SHOT.

As Gila pointed out, I don't want this thread to become anti hunting but these are good examples of why ethical shots and practice are important. Practice practice practice for many months before you get out into the woods, be prepared to crawl on your hands and knees looking for blood after you hiked 6 miles and took a shot, even when your dead tired, and an elk is worth more respect from you than a Texas heart shot.

 

[mavinwa2]

oh, forgot. In 2014, shot a spike bull in WA State with Rifle/modern firearm general season. This about 3.5 weeks after archery elk season ended.
bull was hobbling along, visibly limping struggling. One shot in the neck put the bull down. Ended the beast's suffering.
I lost an entire rear quarter of meat, 12" of one backstrap near the spoiled area.. And found a lodged Rage broadhead +2"arrow in it's hip. The entire area around that Rage broadhead was spoiled, stunk bad. Meat in that area bad color, yellow pus, yellow fat. Had butcher inspect the other rear quarter & other meat. Just the one rear quarter was bad.

 

[Gila]

I guess I started this thread because I was curious what the numbers on these wounded shots that never get recovered actually looked like. I agree with you:
"I think that a thread like this could be a good reminder to us all to evaluate our ehthics and to review tactics to be better hunters."
And was hoping that some folks had good tips for tracking wounded animals, as it seems to be a sore spot that many folks don't have a lot of experience with, myself included.
I certainly think people should be out hunting and learning but as stated... this thread is a good reminder to make sure you are practiced at the hunting tool of your choice and to make ethical shots

Also shout out to Socorro NM, I went to high school and NMT there, we probably crossed paths and I dunno if you know Tim but I learned to hunt under his tutelage. My first elk was on the eastern slope of the magdalenas with a muzzleloader

I went by the RV camp up there a couple of weeks ago and it was filling up with hunters. Always good to see. Tim is rather famous for taking his horses up into the Cibola for the Muzzie hunt. I Don't know him personally though. I have been down here over 4 years now. This thread reminds me that I need to get a rechargeable headlamp. I have a first rifle tag for the Gila next month.

 

[Stubborn_bowhunter]

I see no difference when comparing a lion failing to kill an animal. We're also natural critters whether we want to act higher than nature, or not.

I standby the old saying you probably haven't been hunting very long if you've never botched a shot. It sucks, but just like a lion failing to kill we may also lose prey.

It is one thing if you know for certain an animal you shot is going to die. If you don't know and gave every effort then it's on you to make the choice. I can and have lived with wounding an elk then moving onto keep hunting. I spent two days looking for it, had photos of it alive a month later.

I've also heard the argument "that you still shouldn't consider your tag filled if you don't find said animal. It's for proof of legal transfer of ownership from the state to you. If you didn't find the animal you have nothing to own besides your gut wrenching feeling. Whether you want to keep hunting after giving your best effort, but failing to find the critter. That's on you. You technically did not take an animal though."

 

[Wellsdw]

I do believe this is illegal in most of the west, I’d research before just using a dog.

Currently out west tracking dogs are illegal in AZ, NV, OR, and WA. Everywhere else out west they are legal

 

[Werty]

I will add this. Most of the people I know, who mess up in life, work harder the next time so it never happens again. Also, shooting at a target is not the same as shooting at a live animal. Unfortunately it takes time to learn. I wish it wasn't true.

 

[Stubborn_bowhunter]

I will add this. Most of the people I know, who mess up in life, work harder the next time so it never happens again. Also, shooting at a target is not the same as shooting at a live animal. Unfortunately it takes time to learn. I wish it wasn't true.

Very true. I know guys who shoot competition and miss a lot of animals.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

If that was the case, we wouldn't be on this forum because hunting would have been outlawed along time ago. I think that a thread like this could be a good reminder to us all to evaluate our ehthics and to review tactics to be better hunters. Unfortunately because of mere conjecture and highly emotional opinion, this thread is degrading rapidly to the point of being ANTI-HUNTING.

I don’t think its anti-hunting as much as it is a reminder to respect the animals we hunt and don’t act like entitled selfish idiots.

 

[CAElkhunter]

Nothing pisses me off more than hearing about people that wound elk and then go out the next day and shoot another. Last year in NM my outfitter was almost bragging about letting clients take 700 and 800 yd shots wounding the elk not finding it then letting them shoot another the next day or so. Eventually this kind of behavior will effect the Elk #'s. I personally believe you have an obligation to spend a few days looking for the wounded elk until you are certain you cannot find him. Not go out the next am, look around and say lets go find another.....This goes along with enjoying the Elk experience which sometimes ends up in tag soup. It is not always about the kill.

 

[Ono]

Very true on a dog. Most tracking dogs will have no problem on a 16-24 hr trail as long as it’s not to disturbed by us, or extreme weather. A lot of Blood isn’t even necessary for many dogs. He’ll I brought mine to Wyoming just in case and boarded him in the near by town. A good resource to find a tracking dog is United blood trackers website.

True. On an evening hunt, hit a cow. The heavens opened and it started to pour. I watched the blood disappear as I was tracking. Brought the dogs back the next morning, once downwind, led me straight to her. Would have found her gridding, but dogs made quick work of it.

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