moose with a muzzleloader

[sabotloader]

So the Knight DISC extreme they had at Sportsmans had the thunb hole stock on it. Any advantage to that? I have never owned a rifle in the past with that not sure I want or need one now.

Good question.... Forever and that is all the way back to the dinosaurs, according to my kids, I swore I would never use a TH for hunting - it might be really good for the bench as the thumbhole allows a natural hand position. With the thumb through the TH and the grip of the hand it does reduce recoil. With the hand in that position it allows you to get on and have a better feel of the trigger and I believe with all this added you shoot more accurately and more consistent of the bench, but never hunting!!!

Today - and after hunting several years now with a TH - I am sold... I really do prefer the TH all-around.... but that is just me!

One thing also TH or normal straight stock you may find the Knight LOP a tad bit long in hunting clothes. the LOP if a DISC is about 14 1/4" inches. I really like 13 1/2 to 13 3/4 " but I am a short armed 5-10/11 guy...

 

[wolfman]

Thanks for the input! Yet one more thing to consider. LOL!

 

[sabotloader]

Thanks for the input! Yet one more thing to consider. LOL!

I know what you mean!!!

 

[wolfman]

So I bought the Knight DISC extreme with the thumbhole stock at Sportsmans. But one of the first things I read in the manual was it wasn't designed to shoot sabotless bullets, I am paraphrasing here, but it also goes on to say if you do shoot without sabots that you need to make sure the bullet is still seated prior to shooting. I assume this is just a CYA thing by Knight. Thanks for the heads up on the DVD too Umpqua hunter. Lots of good money saving info in there.

 

[sabotloader]

So I bought the Knight DISC extreme with the thumbhole stock at Sportsmans. But one of the first things I read in the manual was it wasn't designed to shoot sabotless bullets,

Correct, but that is a selling point in 48 states. It will shoot the large big conicals just fine also. I shoot a .503-460 grain Bull Shop with 90 grains of T7-3f and a #11 Mag cap. Elk really do not like it and the deer hate it so bad they lay down.

I am paraphrasing here, but it also goes on to say if you do shoot without sabots that you need to make sure the bullet is still seated prior to shooting. I assume this is just a CYA thing by Knight.

With a lead conical, actually any conical, it is very important to have the projectile seated on the powder, If there is an air gap between the powder and the projectile it really can spike the ignition pressure. With a sabot it is just as important to seat the sabot on the powder but with a sabot if the pressure increases to much to fast it will blow the polymer sabot out and provide a pressure release... not so with a solid full bore bullet.

Thanks for the heads up on the DVD too Umpqua hunter. Lots of good money saving info in there.

Oh! congrats on the purchase! I hope you can find someone in your area that has shooting experience with a ML and work with him or her a few times. If you were close to Moscow, ID - I would certainly invite you over for a shooting trip to the farm. I have a good friend in Yakima that would also be a good resource.

 

[wolfman]

So do you find that the bullet will unseat a bit during the hunt? I understand you should check it prior to firing but just curious.

 

[sabotloader]

So do you find that the bullet will unseat a bit during the hunt? I understand you should check it prior to firing but just curious.

With conicals like the Thor or the Hornady FPB, probably not much chance of that, with a Power Belt that could be a possibility. With lead conicals and especially the ones that you have to use a short starter to even get them through the crown - very little chance they will come off once seated.

With 'slip fit' there is a possibility of them coming off. That is the good thing about Bull Shop, Dan will size them to fit your bore correctly so they will not slip off - yet remain a 'slip fit'.

In one GM barrel I use a .503 and in another a .504 to avoid that worry.

Anytime you drop or make a violent movement with a ML and a heavy lead Conical not a bad ideal to make sure it is still seated.

mike

 

[robby denning]

Wolfman, I've never had the PR 450 Utimate One come unseated and I check it a lot with a mark on my ramrod. Some time at the range will tell you for sure.

 

[wolfman]

Thanks guys.
So Mike on the one of the loads you showed your data for I believe it was with a 460gr bullet with 90gr of powder and #11 primer. I was wondering if there was perhaps a 209 primer that might be comparable to #11 cap? I know I need to work up a load to work in my gun but would like to at least have a place to start without re-inventing the wheel entirely.

 

[sabotloader]

Thanks guys.
So Mike on the one of the loads you showed your data for I believe it was with a 460gr bullet with 90gr of powder and #11 primer. I was wondering if there was perhaps a 209 primer that might be comparable to #11 cap? I know I need to work up a load to work in my gun but would like to at least have a place to start without re-inventing the wheel entirely.

You could get a very mild primer like any of the ML primers on the market, either Winchester or Remington - it still would not be as cool as a cap - so it will likely create a 'crud ring' near the breech in the gun. You will need to run a damp patch after each shoot to clear the 'crud ring'. If you make them right you will not need a dry patch after. If you can not find any ML primers try for some Win W209's.

Here is how I make mine...



I would advise you to start at 70 grains and work your way up.

If you are going to shoot heavy conicals - you will really like the thumbhole...

Are you going to put a western Kit in this rifle eventually? or is it going to stay a 209 rifle - if so I hope you got the bare primer option.

mike

 

[wolfman]

Mike I haven't thought that far down the road yet. For now I think I am going to leave it as it is as I am not going to have a lot of extra time to mess around with it this Summer between getting a decent load worked up and scouting. Thanks for the tip on patches!

 

[wolfman]

Mike where did you get the Williams peep sight and the hooded front sight? I am thinking I might want to install those on my ML.

 

[sabotloader]

Mike where did you get the Williams peep sight and the hooded front sight? I am thinking I might want to install those on my ML.

I bought mine directly from Williams... 800 530-9028 ext. 228 - should get you to Steve who can get the parts for you....

When/if you get them there might be an installation problem - but it is a really easy fix...

Couple of points... actually we might should talk...

Might read through this thread....

and check your PM messages

mike

 

[30338]

Drew a cow moose tag for unit 6. Planning on using a custom Hawken with a .530 roundball and .015 patch. Somewhere around 90 grains of ff should do it. Thinking you have been given a lot of good advice on here. I just like a simpler 1 in 70 twist roundball shooter that doesn't kick much and looks pretty nice. Hope you smoke a monster one up there.

 

[wolfman]

Congrats 30338! Thanks! Maybe I will see you up there! I am thinking I might make a camping trip up there this weekend to do a little looking around.

 

[30338]

Hey Wolfman, I am headed south to S9 to do first hike and look for sheep this weekend. We may have to get together in late August for a scouting trip up there. Good luck. Kurt

 

[wolfman]

Yeah 30338 that might not be a bad idea about scouting in late August.

 

[wolfman]

So in doing my research on hunting Moose in this unit I talked to a few people that have experience hunting here. 2 of them told me that the Bulls will be in the rut during regular rifle season more so then during muzzleloader season. Now I could swap my tag for rifle season and still hunt it with my muzzleloader and have my rifle along on the trip just in case. Or I could just hunt with my rifle. I figured that during muzzleloader season it might be better due to less pressure from the elk hunters and not too many hunting Moose at that point. But I am wondering now if I should rethink my plan? What do you guys think?

 

[wolfman]

So the scouting trip was fruitfull. Figure we saw around 2% of the unit population. Need to get back up there in August at least to really get a handle on things.

 

[30338]

Bulls must be growing antler pretty fast. We were down south scouting sheep and saw a herd of bull elk that were getting pretty darn big already. No sheep but the cutthroats were biting. Good luck with your bull strategizing, sounds like you are in and around them.