Rifle for my son - .308 or 6.5 CM ?

[Newtosavage]

Last Christmas, my son (24, disabled vet) said he wanted a hunting rifle. I raised him bowhunting and he never really hunted with rifles that much, but now that he's a CO resident, he would like a rifle for the range and occasional hunts.

I have a Savage build ready to go for him, with either of two barrels. A .308 or 6.5 CM. I was originally thinking of giving him the .308 since he doesn't reload, ammo is inexpensive and readily available, and he may hunt elk on occasion. But I also have a 6.5 CM barrel for that same action. Ammo prices are really coming down and I'm finding CM ammo at every Wal-mart these days.

My only hesitation is that the .308 barrel I have only likes 150 grain bullets. Any time I shoot 165's the groups open up and 180's are pitiful. Not growing up shooting hunting rifles, he's not used to a lot of recoil, so the 150's would probably be his preference anyway.

Is there any advantage to the .308 with 150's over a CM shooting 140's for someone like him?

 

[Sportsman]

6.5 CM. No advantage on the slight bump to 150's.

You have the barrel so that rules out other options but I've read the are increasing twist rate for heavier bullets. Browning is now using 1:7

 

[Newtosavage]

That's kinda what I'm thinking. I just don't have any experience yet with the CM.

After installing that Savage .308 barrel and running 150's, 165's and 180's through it, I remembered that both the 2 previous Savage .308's I owned (model 10's) also preferred the 150's.

The .308 barrel does like plain 'ol green box Remington 150's, which of course is some of the easiest ammo to find.

 

[deadwolf]

If your option is a .308 150gr or say a 143Eldx in the 6.5, the choice is easy to make.

Take the 143 eldx all day.


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[Buckwise9]

I have personally see what a eldx in the 6.5 can do in the hands of a 12yr old at 300yds on a whitetail. No track job needed. Sweet caliber.

 

[BRTreedogs]

The concept and favorability of 6.5 bullets is they are long, sleek and have a high bc "means the fly thru the air easier", so if all other things are equalish say they both have a muzzle velocity exactly the same aka 2700.
At any range let's say 500 a 6.5 bullet will or I guess I should say "could" be carrying more energy still. Because it retains velocity better with more efficient flight.
Get on a ballistics calculator and do some comparison.

 

[Sportsman]

I chose 140 grain Accubond (Federal Premium) for Elk. Killed cow this year although only 47 yard shot so can't say much.

ELDX is great for deer. Seems most folks favor accubond or nosler partitions for Elk. No partition commercial ammo available for 6.5 CM in 140s. Would go with partition for elk if I reloaded. Look forward to that day.

 

[deerhunter628]

I think they are both pretty equal. You need to shoot pretty far for the 6.5 to bump the advantage. The .308 has a big advantage of how much factory ammo is available. I have both, but for hunting I usually grab my .308.

 

[N2TRKYS]

If your .308 likes lighter bullets, try some Barnes 130 grain TTSX.

 

[Newtosavage]

If your .308 likes lighter bullets, try some Barnes 130 grain TTSX.

If I were going to keep it, I would just hand load for it. But it's going to my son who doesn't hand load and I don't ever expect him to. He needs something he can just stop by the store and get ammo for, on his way to the range or the mountains.

Not sure about in the Denver area, but at least around here CM ammo is nearly as common as .270 on the Wal-mart shelves, and just as cheap. I picked up a box of 140 Core-lokts today ($17.47) to test for him and I also have some Hornady ELD-X's If either of those shoot well, I'll just tell him to feed those through it and call it a day.

I was dead set on the .308 until I shot it. In a 7 lb rifle, the 165's and especially 180's will get your attention. I'm used to it but I doubt he would care for that much recoil, especially if he takes his girlfriend to the range and she wants to shoot.

Sounds like 140's in the CM will be plenty for him so long as he keeps the shots a reasonable distance (and he will). Plus he can get 120's if he wants the GF to shoot it. That's probably the better way to go.

 

[Newtosavage]

The concept and favorability of 6.5 bullets is they are long, sleek and have a high bc "means the fly thru the air easier", so if all other things are equalish say they both have a muzzle velocity exactly the same aka 2700.
At any range let's say 500 a 6.5 bullet will or I guess I should say "could" be carrying more energy still. Because it retains velocity better with more efficient flight.
Get on a ballistics calculator and do some comparison.

I didn't shoot the 150 .308 Core-lokt's over my chrono, but the box claims 2820 fps. vs. 2700 for the same box of 6.5 CM. That said, according to the data on the boxes, the CM is moving faster than the .308 already by 200 yards and carries 83 fps. more velocity at 300 yards. The velocities printed on the Remington boxes are notoriously fast compared to real world results. I did chrono the 180 Core-lokts and out of the 22" Savage barrel, they were doing more than 100 fps. less than the factory specs.

I'll run the 140's from the CM over the chrono and see what I get.

 

[N2TRKYS]

If I were going to keep it, I would just hand load for it. But it's going to my son who doesn't hand load and I don't ever expect him to. He needs something he can just stop by the store and get ammo for, on his way to the range or the mountains.

Not sure about in the Denver area, but at least around here CM ammo is nearly as common as .270 on the Wal-mart shelves, and just as cheap. I picked up a box of 140 Core-lokts today ($17.47) to test for him and I also have some Hornady ELD-X's If either of those shoot well, I'll just tell him to feed those through it and call it a day.

I was dead set on the .308 until I shot it. In a 7 lb rifle, the 165's and especially 180's will get your attention. I'm used to it but I doubt he would care for that much recoil, especially if he takes his girlfriend to the range and she wants to shoot.

Sounds like 140's in the CM will be plenty for him so long as he keeps the shots a reasonable distance (and he will). Plus he can get 120's if he wants the GF to shoot it. That's probably the better way to go.

With ammo being so easy and usually cheaper to order online, I haven't worried about buying it in the local stores.

Sounds like you've made your decision.

 

[Sportsman]

My local Sportsman has a large selection of 6.5 CM and if I watch specials, cheaper than online. You don't always want the quantities required to buy online and break even on shipping, especially when you're figuring out which ammo shoots best.

I spot check Walmarts for the heck of it and it seems to be pretty easy to find. I've seen a huge increase in availability since I got my CM two years ago.

 

[NorCalFD]

I’d also go for the 6.5 with the TTSX’s as well. Great combo all around!

 

[Newtosavage]

Shot two factory loads at the range yesterday. The Hornady 143 ELD-X were as expected - consistently around MOA and sometimes better. Typical "ho hum, 1 MOA" consistency I've come to expect from those.

But the 140 Core Lokts... wow. Just AWFUL. This is two boxes of Core lokts (180 .308 and now 140 CM) that have just been all over the map. We're talking 3" groups at best at 100 yards. It's hard to believe one box of factory ammo can shoot MOA and the next is like a shotgun pattern, from the same barrel.

 

[30338]

Sounds like you just need to buy 5 or 6 boxes of 143 ELD ammo and he is set.

Going to try some 135 berger hybrid factory ammo once my 6.5 gets finished. Haven't shot factory ammo in 25 years and curious about the 6.5 creedmoor.

 

[Newtosavage]

I'm having the same experience with Hornady 6.5 CM ammo. Very consistent from this Savage barrel. Three cold 1st shots at the range now have produced a 3/4" group over the last 4 days. That's what I look for in a hunting rifle.

30338, I think your suggestion is a good one.