SAAMI Approved Modern .25 cal???

[Formidilosus]

Hornady also came out with the 376 Steyr, 30 TC, 338 Marlin Express, 308 Marlin, 300 and 338 RCM and probably others that they didn't support. They also had a temper tantrum and refused to support the 6.8 Western. They have too much influence on the industry in my opinion.

I agree Winchester does need to market better.

So that’s actually a pretty clear indication of what happens when you bring a “hunting” focused cartridge to the market where there is no large gap. The pure “hunting” community does not shoot enough ammo to justify keeping any new cartridge for long. Hunters do not drive innovation or ammo sales- shooters do. Hornady has done extremely well with “precision” or “target” focused rounds. However, if your cartridge is based on “shooters”, then it’s easy to drop a hunting bullet in it and have a great hunting cartridge too.


The 6.8 Western is another example of it. This is historically true as well- the 30-06, 308, 5.56/223, 9mm and 45 auto are, or were, all military and “shooting” cartridges first. If Hornady brought out a 7mm “hunting” cartridge that was designed as most hunting cartridges are- it wouldn’t sell either. It isn’t just marketing- saying so ignores why these cartridges continue to sell and make it, and others such as the WSM’s, 6.8 Western, etc didn’t or won’t.

 

[ElPollo]

So that’s actually a pretty clear indication of what happens when you bring a “hunting” focused cartridge to the market where there is no large gap. The pure “hunting” community does not shoot enough ammo to justify keeping any new cartridge for long. Hunters do not drive innovation or ammo sales- shooters do. Hornady has done extremely well with “precision” or “target” focused rounds. However, if your cartridge is based on “shooters”, then it’s easy to drop a hunting bullet in it and have a great hunting cartridge too.


The 6.8 Western is another example of it. This is historically true as well- the 30-06, 308, 5.56/223, 9mm and 45 auto are, or were, all military and “shooting” cartridges first. If Hornady brought out a 7mm “hunting” cartridge that was designed as most hunting cartridges are- it wouldn’t sell either. It isn’t just marketing- saying so ignores why these cartridges continue to sell and make it, and others such as the WSM’s, 6.8 Western, etc didn’t or won’t.

Ammo used to be a side hustle gun makers and a marketing ploy for new guns. Those days are gone because there is less profit in guns than there is in ammo. The ammo business is now largely separated from gun manufacturers. The current market caters to the shooter culture and producing old niche cartridges doesn’t rank. I suspect that doesn’t bode well for the future of 300 Savage and 257 Bob lovers, and the like. And I wouldn’t hold my breathe for a newfangled 25 hunting cartridge to dominate the industry any time soon. The last 25 that really made a real industry impact was the 250 Savage.

 

[Balderdash]

Hornady also came out with the 376 Steyr, 30 TC, 338 Marlin Express, 308 Marlin, 300 and 338 RCM and probably others that they didn't support. They also had a temper tantrum and refused to support the 6.8 Western. They have too much influence on the industry in my opinion.

I agree Winchester does need to market better.

Hi Gerry:

Perhaps I missed something, but how did Hornady throw a temper tantrum over the 6.8W? Maybe just by not supporting it? I can't see how they would be quick to jump on board the 6.8W; they already have a very, very similar, highly successful cartridge in the 6.5 PRC, and as Formidilosis pointed out, it's not like the 6.8W - primarily a hunter centric round, was destined to be a high volume ammo sales proposition. If it gets popular enough, they'll likely get on board.

I'm not a fan or hater of any ammo/components company. I like to use bullets that perform well in flight and terminally, and I'll use whatever brand happens to make bullets that fit my needs and wants. I have used a lot of Hornady bullets over the years in a number of different calibers and ML's, and I can't say that I've ever been let down by their products.

I'm sure you have your reasons for disliking Hornady, but I see them as a company that offers a solid product at a fair price. I've found their Precision line of loaded ammo to be so good in several calibers that I rarely load for them any more. I like to pull the trigger a lot and time is often at a premium, so I greatly appreciate good loaded ammo at fair prices.

 

[WCB]

Hi Gerry:

Perhaps I missed something, but how did Hornady throw a temper tantrum over the 6.8W? Maybe just by not supporting it? I can't see how they would be quick to jump on board the 6.8W; they already have a very, very similar, highly successful cartridge in the 6.5 PRC, and as Formidilosis pointed out, it's not like the 6.8W - primarily a hunter centric round, was destined to be a high volume ammo sales proposition. If it gets popular enough, they'll likely get on board.

I agree...also Hornady no doubt had the 7PRC in the works. People don't realize that capital expense and manufacturing capacity is needed and something like a new cartridge that uses a new case or even previous developed parent case takes R&D. The 6.8 western came out also at a horrible time. 2021 in the middle of the highest ammo demand ever seen by the industry. Why would any company jump to support quite frankly an underwhelming caliber.

I work in the firearms and shooting industry not at a retail level but manufacturing level. The absolute least requested product is anything in 6.8 western out of any new cartridge in the last 8 years. 7PRC already has more traction.