Talking Tipi design

Beendare

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First i want to give a big shout out to the many guys that have opened my eyes to these DIY shelters and the "How To'. The latest being Woodbow that took the time to answer some of my tedious questions.

Though I'm still not done with my first semi wall tent project...since i'm sick as a dog...I decided to play on sketchup for a tipi project. The idea here is 2 men, with extra room, light as we are limited to Supercub weights, and well vented as I've done a few rounds with these tipis and they are condensation monsters....I hate that.

I'm going to modify this design....but its a starting point.
tipi #1 sketchup.jpg

The whole reason for the vertical walls is to install venting around a large % of the perimeter along with 2 roof vents to combat condensation...which works in another tent I use a lot. So even if its raining it will vent with them protected.

Options;
modify to the 45 deg angle of Woodbows tipi...probably a good idea

How much vert wall...and how much eve do I give it????

my SL5 didn't have near enough floor space....but how much is enough?

[This version has 16" walls with about a 10" OH.]
.i don't want to take away from the structural integrity of the tipi itself.

i have to say this Sketchup is about the most intuitive program out there....simply amazing...and when you are done you can measure angles, pieces etc for your cuts.
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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This bottom view gives a better idea of the floorspace with 2 bedrolls to size [seems too small]
Tipi #1 bottom.jpg

It will have a stove so a little more width is probably better....any real world opinions from all of the tipi guys....
 

realunlucky

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For two guys why go with a tipi design over a design like the sawtooth? Just curious

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Beendare

Beendare

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For two guys why go with a tipi design over a design like the sawtooth? Just curious
As you can see i'm just winging it here- grin...looking for opinions.

It seems to me on the bigger shelter with the eve I can get even tension on the tipi which should make it stronger/shed heavy wind better- eh?

I've never played with the Sawtooth style design.
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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BTW, i haven't seen this design with the vents in the eves and the short walls anywhere....did i miss it? As far as I know its an original idea....maybe i should have copyrighted- grin
 

realunlucky

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I don't think your design will shed the wind better due to more vertical wall angles. I'm excited to watch your project come together. Condensation sucks no doubt

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Kevin Dill

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No real opinion to express on your project (yet) but I'll enter the conversation just for understanding. Are you building this unit yourself, or having it sewn elsewhere? I'm curious as to your rationale for going this route versus purchasing a proven setup.

I'm that guy who is always looking for what's going to go wrong, or what won't work very well on my hunt. Considering the weather I (and my friends) have endured on moose and caribou hunts, I wouldn't have the confidence to design and make my own shelter. My Sawtooth arguably saved my life in 2015. I'm not recommending it for 2 guys on a longer hunt, but it's certainly capable.

I'd suggest whatever shelter you end up with should be equipped with external guy-out loops and that they are reinforced at the point of attachment. I credit these with saving my bacon on more than one night during howling winds and sideways rain.
 

WoodBow

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I personally think you are making an immense amount of work for yourself by going with this design. I would install multiple vents, like the ridge vent, in the lower portion of the wall if you are concerned about venting. However, it works quite well to just pitch the tipi off the ground a bit or at least the down wind side. We had 3 guys in mine and certainly had condensation but not to the point that it was an issue. And we did not have a stove.

If you are set on this design, I would make the vertical walled portion an octagon rather than a circle. It will be significantly easier to calculate and sew up

Kevin, his thought process is probably similar to mine. What one man can do, so can another. These are just everyday people sewing these things together at a factory. They are not superheros and it is not rocket science. I realize it is a bit of a leap to take a diy shelter on a backcountry hunt, even more so for a fly in Alaska hunt. I was a little nervous the first year I took a diy tarp as my only shelter on a CO hunt that took me 11 hours to hike in to. But it performed flawlessly and I grew bolder in my projects. Someone on here took a diy sawtooth on an alaska float trip last year or the year before. I thought that was crazy at the time. Now I wouldn't hesitate.
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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......I'm curious as to your rationale for going this route versus purchasing a proven setup.
.
To play devils advocate here.....Why do you go DIY on your hunts....vs hiring a guide? Woodbow nailed it in his response. Its the satisfaction of DIY...and I like building stuff- pretty simple. I would caution that if you think you are going to save yourself money...WRONG....sure the matl is cheap but these are time consuming. The sewing isn't rocket science....if anything my guyouts are overbuilt vs ones done commercially.

I personally think you are making an immense amount of work for yourself by going with this design. I would install multiple vents, like the ridge vent, in the lower portion of the wall if you are concerned about venting. However, it works quite well to just pitch the tipi off the ground a bit or at least the down wind side. We had 3 guys in mine and certainly had condensation but not to the point that it was an issue. And we did not have a stove.

If you are set on this design, I would make the vertical walled portion an octagon rather than a circle. It will be significantly easier to calculate and sew up

......
like this woodbow?
tipi2 floor.jpg
tipi2.jpg

In my first Sketchup tipi design I started with a circle- sucky version I agree...This one is a much better representation- I started with a rectangle...takes all of 10 minutes with this program...love that sketchup.

My experience with tipis [an SL5 that i sold due to condensation issues] and many other tents has led me to this design. My old tipi didn't have a moisture problem when pitched off the ground...ventilation, but drafty. If you can control the draft....it SHOULD be the best of both worlds...thus this design.

Assuming I keep the wall low enough...it shouldn't have a big effect on the inherent structural integrity that the tipi design provides. I think its a winner....but will take some testing to confirm....I have all summer...

I'm trying to come up with a baffled top vent...vs the eve design on all of the other tipis i've seen. Something that lets the air flow out easier....rather than the up,down, then out flow of an upper eve vent....
 

WoodBow

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Yes like that. Not sure how you are drawing your shapes but i used the polygon tool to get it started. Then type tje number of sides you want into the box and the polygon will change shape.

Is your entire vertical wall going to be vent? Maybe every other panel?

It looks like your verical wall does not attach directly to the main wall but rather dog legs over. Unless i am thinking about it wrong, that design simply will not work. You will not be able to pitch it. There is nothing to tension and hold up that inside corner. It will work if the vertical wall attaches directly to the main wall. But then there is no advantage to going to all the trouble rather than just pitching a panel or two off the ground imo.
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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Yes like that. Not sure how you are drawing your shapes but i used the polygon tool to get it started. Then type tje number of sides you want into the box and the polygon will change shape.
^^Thats a good tip, thx. I've only got maybe an hour with this program. The first I started with a circle- bad idea, The second I started with a rectangle...then dissected into 8 pie shaped pieces to develop points to pull up to the apex.

Is your entire vertical wall going to be vent? Maybe every other panel?
No, I think that would be the same as just lifting your tipi edge. it doesn't seem like it would be an advantage. I'm thinking a strip vent 4"-8" tall.

It looks like your verical wall does not attach directly to the main wall but rather dog legs over. Unless i am thinking about it wrong, that design simply will not work. You will not be able to pitch it. There is nothing to tension and hold up that inside corner. It will work if the vertical wall attaches directly to the main wall. But then there is no advantage to going to all the trouble rather than just pitching a panel or two off the ground imo.
Yeah, this is a 10 min sketch...its not shown correctly. The wall is totally vertical creating an eve. The venting will be on the upper portion of the wall protected by the eve. Every other wall might be a good idea...or just a 30" wide by say 6" tall cutout with bugmesh and a flap in each of the 8 sections??
The other advantage to this is I can leave the wall a bit long...say 24" [or more] and raise or lower the whole tipi. It also gives me a mud flap for overlap of a floor tarp which is nice to have in my wall tent.

One disadvantage to this design is it will be heavier.

Wood, how is your tipi for size with 2 guys? What is the width and length of yours? [on the ground diameters]
 

WoodBow

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^^Thats a good tip, thx. I've only got maybe an hour with this program. The first I started with a circle- bad idea, The second I started with a rectangle...then dissected into 8 pie shaped pieces to develop points to pull up to the apex.



No, I think that would be the same as just lifting your tipi edge. it doesn't seem like it would be an advantage. I'm thinking a strip vent 4"-8" tall.



Yeah, this is a 10 min sketch...its not shown correctly. The wall is totally vertical creating an eve. The venting will be on the upper portion of the wall protected by the eve. Every other wall might be a good idea...or just a 30" wide by say 6" tall cutout with bugmesh and a flap in each of the 8 sections??
The other advantage to this is I can leave the wall a bit long...say 24" [or more] and raise or lower the whole tipi. It also gives me a mud flap for overlap of a floor tarp which is nice to have in my wall tent.

One disadvantage to this design is it will be heavier.

Wood, how is your tipi for size with 2 guys? What is the width and length of yours? [on the ground diameters]

Ok yeah that makes more sense.

Mine is about 7.5' at the peak and 15' flat to flat at the base. It is an absolute palace for 2 and rather luxurious for 3.
 

LBFowler

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I think the easiest route for you would be to hang a short inner liner inside that went all the way to the ground to block drafts, and just pitch the "normal" tipi off the ground. If the liner was only attached at the seams there would be lots of gaps for the airflow to enter the tent, but the air would be channeled up along the wall. I believe Tentipi does something similar with their lower vents and the nests they use.
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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I just looked at the Tentipis....another pretty good way to skin a cat.
Onyx 5 light - Tentipi's affordable tent for 4 season performance | Mansfield Outdoors

I doubt they have the condensation problems of the nylon fabrics as its essentially has the breathability of a canvas wall tent with their cotton/Poly fabric. Of course a little heavier. I like that upper vent....like an indian tipi almost [though its not going to work for me]

And I'm looking hard at their zipper orientation. I dunno if that design is an advantage [taking the weight off the zipper?]

If I was buying a base camp tipi I would consider this over something like the silnylon versions companies are selling.
 

Brendan

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I won't comment on design - but I've had heavy condensation in my Sawtooth with the door all the way open, stove jack open, and with 3-4" clearance between the bottom of the shelter and the ground. I think in some conditions - you WILL get it regardless of how much venting you have. Ground sheet can help as it prevents moisture coming up from out of the ground, and best of all - bring a lightweight titanium wood stove if you're not above tree line so you can fire it up to dry out.

If I have the space / weight - I'd want an 8 man tipi or even a 12 man (Although space to pitch can be an issue). Sawtooth sized is great for 1 if you're stuck in it for any length of time, works fine for two, but you won't have much space to move around.

I know - that has nothing to do with shelter design - but some things for you to think about...
 
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Beendare

Beendare

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Some more thoughts;
the whole reason I would even consider another tipi is if I can design around the condensation problem. So I'm going with eves and a wall with vents.

Another way that would be pretty easy would be to come up about 2 feet and drape a light fabric that can act as a wind control when the tipi is pitched off the ground say 6"-8". Velcro around the perimeter can be selectively opened for venting. [i'm too lazy to draw it up to illustrate]
design exact...I will make a piece pattern with seam bias and all to make things easier.


Dang, I love this Sketchup...sure helps with design, calcing angles, lengths, Pieces, etc. When I get my design exact...I will make a piece pattern with seam bias and all to make things easier.
View attachment 49411

It appears the size i want isn't going to mesh well with the fabric [that stronger 1.6 hyper D 58"wide] as my diagram illustrates. The 72" wide fabric would save some sewing...but not avail in the fabric I like.

I played with the oval shapes; 12'x14' type design but a straight octagon works pretty good for maxing out space
 
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