Working up a deer load in Mountaineer

[brunse]

So I finally shot some no excuses through my Mountaineer. I bought three sizing packs. The .500 slid through without much pressure. The .501 was easy but left rifling grooves.

I only shot the 502, 503, 504. Technique was 85 grains Swiss ffg followed by a disc(wad) and the 420 grain conical.

All 3 shot groups. 1-2 wet patches followed by 2 dry patches before each shot. I cleared the nipple before each shot by firing in an empty chamber with a 209 red jacketed primer.

Grouping: 502 were about 2”, 503 3 1/2” and 504 4”.

None appeared to tumble.

Groups were less consistent than the .502 550g conicals (Buffalo arms maybe?? Given to me) with 90g Swiss.

I thinking I will get a box of 460 g no excuses in 502. Some BH 209. Appropriate primers. And work them up with Swiss ffg, some pyrodex I have around and the BH.

Sound reasonable? Suggestions? Do I need a upgraded breechplug or nipple for the BH209? I’m going to hunt Colorado mule deer with it. Thanks s million.

 

[brunse]

So I haven’t ordered any no excuses Bullets yet. I picked up some hornady Great Plains 385g lubed hollow points and bh209. Also picked up some of the recommended primers From bh209 site.

Took four shots with 80 g bh209 by volume (should be 56 by weight) at 75y

These conicals have a skirt yet I loaded them with the black plastic wads I have been using (60/1000s I think).

Three shots grouped well. One was a bit of a flyer.

I did it without cleaning the barrel. Just ran one dry patch between shots.

Primers seemed fine afterwards. Didn’t appear to have significant blowback.

What do you think? Recommendations?

 

[Idaholewis]

The wads are probably doing more harm than good with that particular bullet beings it has a Cupped base (i prefer a Flat Base in Grease Groove Bullets) I have never been a fan of the Hornady Plains bullet because of the Cupped Base. I have always swore by the use of Over powder wads to protect the Bullet base (The base is actually what steers the bullet) But with this particular Bullet you are probably better off without using an Over Powder Wad? A BIG problem i see without using a Wad with Powders like Triple Seven, and BH-209 is they are HOT, energetic Powders and will Burn/melt the Bullet Bases, Kind of a Danged if you do/don’t deal. The 1 type of Wad that i feel might Work best with that Cupped base bullet is the Really Thick Nitro Cards, .510 Diameter, and like .130 Thick. They are gonna be Tougher than any of the others due to their Thickness, and less likely to “Push up” inside the Cupped Base. My Number 1 Choice of Wad material with Grease Groove bullets (Flat base that is) is, And always has been 1/8” Wool Felt.

I have often thought about trying these Hornady Bullets with Lube filled Full in the Cupped Base, start whatever Wad in the Bore, place the Bullet on the Wad and push them to the Powder together. I have some of these Bullets, I will test it sometime.

As for the Black Plastic Wads you speak of, i am curious about those? I have never heard of, or seen black plastic Wads? I use Poly LDPE (Low density polyethylene) Wads in .030 and .060 with my Paper Patch Bullets, They are Clear in Color.

 

[Idaholewis]

Your Group above isn’t bad at all, If you can keep them with the 3

My recommendation would be Bullshop 460s over No Excuses ANY Day. Swiss 2F Powder, With 1/8” Wool felt Wads.


Original Bullshop 460s

I shot this 3 Shot Group, Saved the 4th Bullet and sent it Tom at Accurate Bullet molds and had him Copy it for me

My Bullshop Clone

3 shot Group i shot with My Clone Bullet above, Sized to “Bore Ride” This Target is on 1 of my Videos in a Test Between Wool Felt, and Hard Card (510 Nitro Card) Wads

 

[brunse]

A good friend set me up with them the discs/wads. I have some pics in a previous discussion on this forum. I don’t know the name of them.

He told me the other day after that group I didn’t need them. I was suspicious but thought I would try them until I found out for sure.

I’m scared of leading the barrel... not sure how tough that is to fix.

If I can get done 460 bulk shop or no excuses in .502 that’s probably where I’m heading.... at least eventually for elk. 2020

Thanks.

Knight Mountaineer loads

So I finally broke down and applied for a Colorado Miley muzzleloader tag. I should draw it. I have hunted the area during Archery several times. Taking a buck hasn’t been a problem. I passed lots of forkies and three points but was unable to get close enough to a legitimate 4by. A good...

www.rokslide.com

 

[Idaholewis]

Ok i see the Black OP Wads you speak of, I have never seen those for sale, or heard of them? They are likely home made of ? Material? I have them of Milk carton cardboard, Cork, Gasket Material, All sorts of materials.

I am familiar with the Big 550 Grain Bullets in the other thread, They are Buffalo Arms .502 Diameter, 550 Grain Flat Nose, I thought about Buying the mold from them, But Decided against it due to the Weight, Recoil. They also sell just the Bullet, it is made of 1-20 Alloy (awful hard for a hunting bullet) and lubed with SPG

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[brunse]

So I stretched out to 150y. Shot the Great Plains bullets 385g at the center dot. No wad. 80 g by volume bh209. One shot was just the edge of the paper. Upper shot on clean barrel.

Adjusted scope to right.

Shot three 550 g Buffalo arms .502 at the upper dot with the wad. First shot on clean barrel was the higher one. With two holes touching I went ahead and shot another which touched the other two.

Since my goal I deer with a peep sight I suspect either would work... but I’m having too much fun working it up

I have previously ordered the sizing kits from no excuses so I ordered a sampler of 12 each 420, 460, 495, 600 I think. All in .503.

Maybe I can get some of those through it next weekend.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Idaholewis]

Them Big BACO Bullets get with it! The ONLY thing I don’t like about them for hunting is the Alloy they use, I wish they would offer them in Pure Lead, or a Softer Alloy like 1-40, I will flip them heck about it when I’m back in there (i live 25 minutes from them, i spend entirely to much time in that place ) That Big bullet would be an AWESOME Critter getter if it were made of Pure lead where it could Open/Mushroom Good. Bitterroot Components is who Casts them for BACO

1-20 Is STELLAR Alloy for Long Range BPCR, And Muzzleloader, It Will “Bump up” Good when Fired, But also as important, it will hold it’s Shape Good, Hence why the LARGE majority of Serious World Class competitors use it, even 16-1 Alloy. But when you see 1-20 in a simulated Animal test, It doesn’t open/mushroom much at all (poor performance here) You can count on them Poking a Hole straight through, On a Bigger Animal like an Elk, Depending on the Situation, that can Be ok with our Slow ML Velocities, The Bullet will slow in the Body Cavity and DUMP the Majority of it’s Energy in the Animal, Giving the “Shock n Awe” Factor. But with Deer size Game they Zip right Through and end up in another County

 

[brunse]

Lewis, What is your favorite critter getter in .503 somewhere in the 4-500 g range?

Thanks for the input.

 

[Idaholewis]

Lewis, What is your favorite critter getter in .503 somewhere in the 4-500 g range?

Thanks for the input.

I got a few that i think are HARD to beat! Both in the 400 Grain Range, and of Course my Bullshop Copy Bullet above.

These 2 are AWESOME Bullets at 400 Grains, little less Recoil than my 460s and 485s, and these are ALL the Bullet ever needed to kill ANYTHING in this Country I am just a Bullet Junkie I enjoy Casting, and testing different Bullets.

This is a Lyman Plains (Totally Different than Hornady Great Plains) These come in at 395 Grains, Flat Base, And a Decent Meplat instead of a Hollow Point. This is a Bullet Mold only, These Bullets are not Made and Sold. This is a Taper design Muzzleloader Bullet, The Front band being the Largest (Driving Band)

And these are From a Custom Bullet Mold i had made, These are a NON Taper, I size these per Bore. The Bullet drops at .504, I Size them anywhere from .499 to .503 Depending on Bore Diameter? And if i choose to Target/Bench Shoot them as “Bore Riders” These Bullets killed an Elk Last year, The first Bullet out of the New Mold This is a GOOD one!!

I sent a few of these to Jonathan of Frontiermuzzleloading to shoot in his Stock 1:48 Twist Rifle, they didn’t do anything real spectacular for him, It made me nervous about my new bullet so i headed out to test them in my 1:28 Twist Green Mountain LRH Barrel, They did AWESOME