243 Win bullets

[Newtosavage]

Not even close. I kill them at close to twice that distance with .223’s.


With a 1-10” twist I would start with the 95gr Nosler Ballistic Tip- whether Federal or Winchester loaded. Have a couple of hundred deer with the 95gr NBT and 243 win. Including rather large WT and Mule deer bucks out to 527 yards.


Those, HSM’s 95gr Berger VLD, or Hornady Precision Hunter 90gr will all crush the biggest mule deer walking at well past 350 yards.

You're shooting muleys with a .223 at 700 yards?

I'm sorry but that's completely irresponsible in my opinion. Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's ethical.

 

[Cant hit em]

Tikka compact 243 using Barnes TSX 80grn . Have only shot those to 200yds with good results. Harvested 1 critter and my daughter will be shooting them for deer and antelope this year

 

[Formidilosus]

You're shooting muleys with a .223 at 700 yards?

I'm sorry but that's completely irresponsible in my opinion. Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's ethical.

Have you ever done it? And what makes it unethical? The fact that the idea and the reality doesn’t jive with your beliefs?

The reality is there are .224 bullets that cause sufficient tissue disruption at close to double “350 yards”. I wouldn’t waste the recoil of a 243 for sub 400 yards.

 

[Newtosavage]

Have you ever done it? And what makes it unethical? The fact that the idea and the reality doesn’t jive with your beliefs?

The reality is there are .224 bullets that cause sufficient tissue disruption at close to double “350 yards”. I wouldn’t waste the recoil of a 243 for sub 400 yards.

No, I've never done it and I don't ever plan to. I've seen too many deer lost at much closer ranges to the .223 to ever think of using it at 700 yards.

You're an outlier for sure. Don't expect to gain a following with those ideas.

 

[204guy]

I'm a follower of Forms ideas. I haven't seen him proven wrong yet. Plus he can post pics of dead elk and mule deer. Gives him some credibility.

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[Formidilosus]

No, I've never done it and I don't ever plan to. I've seen too many deer lost at much closer ranges to the .223 to ever think of using it at 700 yards.

What bullets? What ranges?

 

[Newtosavage]

I'm a follower of Forms ideas. I haven't seen him proven wrong yet. Plus he can post pics of dead elk and mule deer. Gives him some credibility.

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So you have no problem with .223 at 700 yards for deer? Okay. Ya'll have fun.

Tough to post pics of lost deer. LOL

 

[FLAK]

LIke others have said, Interlocks and Partitions for me in the 100gr.
Killed a bunch of stuff with both, no problems

 

[wind gypsy]

I'm a follower of Forms ideas. I haven't seen him proven wrong yet. Plus he can post pics of dead elk and mule deer. Gives him some credibility.

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I concur. He and others have posted enough pictures of the damage done by 77 TMK and similar to make it credible IMO. I'd be interested to compare terminal performance of a 77 TMK vs 80ish grain .243 mono. I suspect the overall damage would favor the 77 TMK and yet how many people scoff at using .243 Monos for deer?

My personal experience with the 77 TMK through a 20" AR has shown "margin of deer vitals" accuracy very repeatable at 550 yards (end of the silhouette range I used to frequent) with mild to moderate winds. That is limited by AR mag length - 2.30" COAL with a 1" bullet is not optimal.. A longer barrel, longer loaded bullets, and higher pressures from a bolt rifle would only improve those ballistics. 600 yards classifies as "close to twice that distance" to me.

 

[Wrench]

My daughter has a 10 twist 243 that spits 105 amax's as tight as our 8 twist guns do all the way down to 2k feet. I can't comment below that elevation.

As for 223 at long range....I've killed enough yotes with my ai and heavies to assure you that it certainly would be fine in the right hands for deer. Not a great blood trail, but deer at range don't tend to run hard either.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

Who shoots SMK at game?

Close to double 350 doesn’t mean 700.. but we’ll not let comprehension get in the way of a good arguement.

What does the bullets bc have to do with 1/2 moa shooter or not. My experience has been flat base bullets shoot tighter then BOat tails all things equal



Not sure what kind of armoured tank deer you guys are Shooting, but The mule deer and lopes killed by it show The 77gr tmk just plain doesn’t work. Mind you if you take the track record of my 300 win mag in 2017 and the 77gr tmk since... haven’t got more then 25 yard death run since the switch.. that was the outlier. 13 out of 15 have been bang flops except a close doe I shot her jaw off the bullet frags passed just to the side of spine and I had to follow up with a neck shot.

Performance from the measly 223 looks like this.

 

[wind gypsy]

Who shoots SMK at game?

Probably not many 223s, but here’s a 300 SMK where it stopped in an elks heart after going through the front of the hind quarter

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[204guy]

You guys are a bunch or irresponsible, unethical, intelligent, able to understand that a 77tmk at 1750fps impact velocity is going to create plenty of damage to kill a deer, killing sob's.

 

[204guy]

Lawnboi, to your OP, you already easily answered your own ?. The 90gr accubond will do anything you're looking to do. Literally any .243 load off the shelf weighing 85-100 grains is going to be perfectly adequate to kill any deer at distances far greater than 350yds.

 

[Newtosavage]

Using a cartridge that was designed to wound humans on animals at extended distances does not fall under ethical to me.

Been saying this for years but some folks just don't want to hear it. I guess that's why some states have to actually legislate ethics.

 

[Lawnboi]

Thanks for the input. I’m enjoying the conversation as it does relate to what the 243 could do. We have should have quite a few deer tags, so I may get to stretch the range on the 243 a little bit.


As far as 223 goes we have one of those too, that easily holds moa, but I know what wind can do to those little bullets even at meager ranges. I’m not near as experienced shooter as some here.

 

[wind gypsy]

Been saying this for years but some folks just don't want to hear it. I guess that's why some states have to actually legislate ethics.

Form and Ndbowhunter have a much broader knowledge and experience base than the vast majority of people on this forum when it comes to external ballistics. To call them unethical about choosing what they do to shoot animals is laughable.

Yeah, there might be some unintended side effects and it's other people who don't have the knowledge and experience incorrectly extrapolating the info shared and making shitty decisions. IE - "I saw terminal ballistics photos on rokslide showing 223s killing well at 500 yards, so i'm good to go with my:

• CDL dials because they do the work for me
• Ballistics off the ammo box
• BDC reticle or milling reticle
• 223 Ammo that doesn't perform like 77 TMK, Fed Fusion, etc
• unverified competency/wind impacts/dope

And on and on. The same problems present themselves if someone is using a 300 WM to shoot at 600 yards without a proper knowledge base. But I don't see anyone saying to use 55 grain OTMs or FMJs for deer..

 

[Newtosavage]

So are you disagreeing with me, or 406Smith, or Colorado, Connecticut, Illinois, Iowa, Massachusetts, Virginia, Ohio, New Jersey, Washington, and West Virginia, all of whom require larger bullets to be used to hunt game? I can't tell.

 

[Formidilosus]

Using a cartridge that was designed to wound humans on animals at extended distances does not fall under ethical to me. But I'm not your dad, so go nuts.

The 223 wasn’t designed to wound humans. That’s a complete myth with no basis in reality. And excuse me, but I was unaware that the 77gr TMK, 75 and 88gr ELD-M existed in the 1950’s.

The tissue damage created by the above bullets are what most would consider “horrific”. Not one person, no matter how much they were just positive that a 223 is too small has ever seen what the 77gr TMK does and said “not enough”.

Been saying this for years but some folks just don't want to hear it. I guess that's why some states have to actually legislate ethics.

Bullets change. There wasn’t a bullet made 20 years ago that could do what bullets now do.
Please regale us with your knowledge and use of .224 projectiles on 100-300 pound mammals. Projectile, placement, range, angle, results.

 

[Pro953]

The ethics apply to the user not the tool.



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