Montana 2022 Elk Regs

[slim9300]

I hope they stick with “it is only valid while hunting with the outfitter” or else a lot of drop camps are going to be booked! Or 1 or 2 day commitments.


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I certainly don’t think they thought this one through. I will be curious what portion of non-resident hunters are guided. This will be the first year they have any solid data on the topic.


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[Hookhunter75]

I hope they stick with “it is only valid while hunting with the outfitter” or else a lot of drop camps are going to be booked! Or 1 or 2 day commitments.


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Agreed I think it’s great if you get the benefit of two points so you can book hunts with a little more certainty. But there should be strict detailed rules surrounding utilization of the license.

 

[slim9300]

Agreed I think it’s great if you get the benefit of two points so you can book hunts with a little more certainty. But there should be strict detailed rules surrounding utilization of the license.

They may need to consider allowing non-residents the ability to apply for both elk and deer combos individually if this is their longterm plan.


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[dreamingbig]

I certainly don’t think they thought this one through. I will be curious what portion of non-resident hunters are guided. This will be the first year they have any solid data on the topic.


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It was shot down the first time through normal process in committee but then they added it to the catch all clean up bill on the last day of the legislative session and passed it anyway. They didn’t listen to the people.


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[Deadfall]

How certain are you about that? Page 17 of the 2022 elk regs reads…

“Licenses issued using this point are only valid for hunting with an outfitter.”

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Oh nice. I missed that. Very good

 

[Riplip]

I saw that. But can the outfitter ‘release you’ after your obligation to them is filled? Say you have a big game combo and you are only hunting elk during archery season, but want to come back in November for deer somewhere else. I think there are still some questions to be answered on this topic since these tags are not coming from a special outfitter pool and the intent was to support the outfitters. I have a feeling there is going to be more to come before the season starts.

It also begs the question, how often do you have to be in the presence of your outfitter or his guide? There are lots of outfitters that have self-guided individuals. Are they eligible for the outfitter preference point?


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Section 8 of the updated code states that if you purchase a second point under this regulation "the nonresident may only use the license when accompanied by an outfitter or outfitters designee licensed to provide guiding services."

The language is pretty clear, you must be accompanied by an outfitter at all times. It does not address your question about hunting different species. It is my understanding that the intention of the regulation is that you must be accompanied and guided at all times if you use the outfitter point. regardless of species. I tried to call FWP to confirm but did not get through. I will try again tomorrow.

 

[Deadfall]

I hope they stick with “it is only valid while hunting with the outfitter” or else a lot of drop camps are going to be booked! Or 1 or 2 day commitments.


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That's how it used to be. Had to be guided to use the tag. No drop camps.

 

[slim9300]

Section 8 of the updated code states that if you purchase a second point under this regulation "the nonresident may only use the license when accompanied by an outfitter or outfitters designee licensed to provide guiding services."

The language is pretty clear, you must be accompanied by an outfitter at all times. It does not address your question about hunting different species. It is my understanding that the intention of the regulation is that you must be accompanied and guided at all times if you use the outfitter point. regardless of species. I tried to call FWP to confirm but did not get through. I will try again tomorrow.

I was curious too and couldn’t get through. I think they are a little busier than normal with all the questions about the changes.


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[Riplip]

Spoke with FWP today.

If you apply using the additional outfitter PP you must be accompanied at all times by a licensed outfitter even if you purchase a combo tag for deer and elk, although it can be a different outfitter. So if you contract with an outfitter for an archery elk hunt and want to come back for a rifle deer hunt later in the year you are required to use an outfitter.

If you apply using the outfitter PP and do not draw a big game license this year, you will only be allowed to use the additional point you obtained next year if you use an outfitter.

I saw that. But can the outfitter ‘release you’ after your obligation to them is filled? Say you have a big game combo and you are only hunting elk during archery season, but want to come back in November for deer somewhere else. I think there are still some questions to be answered on this topic since these tags are not coming from a special outfitter pool and the intent was to support the outfitters. I have a feeling there is going to be more to come before the season starts.

It also begs the question, how often do you have to be in the presence of your outfitter or his guide? There are lots of outfitters that have self-guided individuals. Are they eligible for the outfitter preference point?


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Spoke with FWP today.

If you apply using the additional outfitter PP you must be accompanied at all times by a licensed outfitter even if you purchase a combo tag for deer and elk, although it can be a different outfitter. So if you contract with an outfitter for an archery elk hunt and want to come back for a rifle deer hunt later in the year you are required to use an outfitter. I asked how this would be enforced and he stated that he has not seen a new license example but that the licenses will be marked as "special outfitter license", and if you are hunting you will need to be with the outfitter.

In addition they clarified that if you apply using the outfitter PP and do not draw a big game license this year, you will only be allowed to use the additional point you obtained next year if you use an outfitter.

 

[dreamingbig]

Thanks for updating us. That is a LOT of enforcement to sign up for but I guess if if I printed on the tag and differentiated there it could work.


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[Scottf270]

Hunted deer in Montana off and on for 30 years. Never hunted elk.
My questions are:
1. If hunting elk only and going guided, would the hunter apply for the elk combo only, or the big game combo?

2. Can a hunter hunt guided for elk, apply for an elk combo and then apply on his own for a deer combo and be unguided for deer? Or how about the reverse?

3. Unless a hunter is hunting guided for both species, I don't see why they would need or want to apply for the big game combo.?

I already had a guy planning to try applying guided for elk, then taking his deer tag somewhere else and hunt on his own. I don't think that's legit and hope it doesn't work like that.

 

[Erict]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Elk B or Deer B (antlerless) licenses are not drawn using PP and the "outfitter" requirement would not apply to those tags either.

 

[dreamingbig]

Hunted deer in Montana off and on for 30 years. Never hunted elk.
My questions are:
1. If hunting elk only and going guided, would the hunter apply for the elk combo only, or the big game combo?

2. Can a hunter hunt guided for elk, apply for an elk combo and then apply on his own for a deer combo and be unguided for deer? Or how about the reverse?

3. Unless a hunter is hunting guided for both species, I don't see why they would need or want to apply for the big game combo.?

I already had a guy planning to try applying guided for elk, then taking his deer tag somewhere else and hunt on his own. I don't think that's legit and hope it doesn't work like that.

You have to apply for an elk combo, a deer combo or an elk and deer combo. You pick one. You can’t apply for both separately. You are either all outfitter or you are not.

This was set up to help the outfitter not the hunter. The MOGA boys and girls pushed the agenda.

Yes B tags are separate.


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[Erict]

Hunted deer in Montana off and on for 30 years. Never hunted elk.
My questions are:
1. If hunting elk only and going guided, would the hunter apply for the elk combo only, or the big game combo?

The hunter would apply for an "OUTFITTER PREFERENCE - ELK COMBO" when ordering online. Assuming they wanted to use PP, they should make sure they have the regular and outfitter PP listed in their checkout list. Another option is to go in to the draw with 0 PP and not be bound by outfitter requirements.

2. Can a hunter hunt guided for elk, apply for an elk combo and then apply on his own for a deer combo and be unguided for deer? Or how about the reverse?

Can only apply for one combo license per year, and can only apply once per year, so not an option - yet. I am not sure they thought this completely out but this is something that should be addressed - and it will if they can make more $$$ or MOGA makes it an issue.

3. Unless a hunter is hunting guided for both species, I don't see why they would need or want to apply for the big game combo.?

Lots of DIY hunters.....

I already had a guy planning to try applying guided for elk, then taking his deer tag somewhere else and hunt on his own. I don't think that's legit and hope it doesn't work like that.

Like it or not, outfitter PP give applicants an advantage. If he draws the Big Game combo (Elk + Deer) using outfitter PP then he got those tags over someone else in the draw and is bound by the "rules" attached to the "advantage". I guess he could always "hunt coyotes" or elk b or deer b and keep that unfilled buck tag handy in his pocket.

 

[repins05]

following.....

 

[sneaky]

May be a lot of plans changing by the app deadline with gas prices skyrocketing along with everything else.

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[dreamingbig]

The hunter would apply for an "OUTFITTER PREFERENCE - ELK COMBO" when ordering online. Assuming they wanted to use PP, they should make sure they have the regular and outfitter PP listed in their checkout list. Another option is to go in to the draw with 0 PP and not be bound by outfitter requirements.


Can only apply for one combo license per year, and can only apply once per year, so not an option - yet. I am not sure they thought this completely out but this is something that should be addressed - and it will if they can make more $$$ or MOGA makes it an issue.


Lots of DIY hunters.....


Like it or not, outfitter PP give applicants an advantage. If he draws the Big Game combo (Elk + Deer) using outfitter PP then he got those tags over someone else in the draw and is bound by the "rules" attached to the "advantage". I guess he could always "hunt coyotes" or elk b or deer b and keep that unfilled buck tag handy in his pocket.

And that would be a game violation by the rules of he filled said buck tag.


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