Which 10MM: Sig P320 Xten, Springfield XD Elite, or M and P?

[rileybassman]

That's really good feedback! I have the FN 510 and really like it. Only two small complaints that make me want to try the X-Ten are, I'd like a slightly nicer trigger and I'd also really like a manual safety (you can buy a grip module and safety).

FWIW, my 510s trigger is nicer then my X-Tens... But I think mine may be the exception not the norm...

The X-ten has a good trigger too

If you are into safeties and nice triggers, 1911 or 220 legions may be an option for you too?

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[fatrascal]

I've been researching the hell out of this subject for a year and a half.
1. The M&P definitely has feeding issues. Not all of them and some people who have a defective one have been able to fix them with new mag springs and by polishing the feed ramp. Some people have not had good luck trying to fix them.
2. The Sig Sauer X-10 has feeding issues and then theres the drop fire issue. When some of the guns are dropped onto the back of the slide it goes off.
3. The Glock does not have a fully supported chamber in the barrel. This results in "Glock Smile" or Glock Swell" and goes by many nicknames. When shooting P+P ammo the brass is able to expand where the round is not supported. Some glocks have been known to blow up because of this. Look up glock smile, glock swell, glock chamber support, glocks blowing up. All youtube videos.
Also, glock octogon barrels allow lead to build up when shooting hard cast bullets creating dangerous pressure and allowing blow ups. Look up glock octogon barrels and barrel replacements. Again on youtube.
4. That brings us to Springfield XDM Elite.
This gun has passed the "10,000 round shooting test." As seen on youtube. It is optics ready. It has a fully supported melanite barrel and can shoot any bullet. Hard cast, copper, lead and anything else. You can get it in 4.5 inch barrel or 3.8 inch barrel. The 4.5 inch barrel has a mag capacity of 15 rounds. The 3.8 inch barrel has a mag capacity of 10 rounds but you can get the extended mag that holds 15 rounds. Look up all of these 10mm guns on youtube and you will learn what i have learned.
The #1 winner is Springfield xdme.
The #2 winner is M&P. Its true some of them have feeding issues but if you are shooting at a charging bear and the gun jams you still have a chance to unjam it. Or as last scenario throw your gun at the bear.
Glock and Sig tie for last place. The Sig has feeding issues and might go off if you drop it on the ground or in your truck. You might get shot. And Glock might blow up in your hand which would give a bear a good place to start eating his appetizer before moving on to the main course.
FN-510. All reviews i've seen have been good but i have not seen extensive testing on it like i have seen on the other 4 name brands. Good luck with your choice and let us know what you get.
Fatrascal.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I've been researching the hell out of this subject for a year and a half.
1. The M&P definitely has feeding issues. Not all of them and some people who have a defective one have been able to fix them with new mag springs and by polishing the feed ramp. Some people have not had good luck trying to fix them.
2. The Sig Sauer X-10 has feeding issues and then theres the drop fire issue. When some of the guns are dropped onto the back of the slide it goes off.
3. The Glock does not have a fully supported chamber in the barrel. This results in "Glock Smile" or Glock Swell" and goes by many nicknames. When shooting P+P ammo the brass is able to expand where the round is not supported. Some glocks have been known to blow up because of this. Look up glock smile, glock swell, glock chamber support, glocks blowing up. All youtube videos.
Also, glock octogon barrels allow lead to build up when shooting hard cast bullets creating dangerous pressure and allowing blow ups. Look up glock octogon barrels and barrel replacements. Again on youtube.
4. That brings us to Springfield XDM Elite.
This gun has passed the "10,000 round shooting test." As seen on youtube. It is optics ready. It has a fully supported melanite barrel and can shoot any bullet. Hard cast, copper, lead and anything else. You can get it in 4.5 inch barrel or 3.8 inch barrel. The 4.5 inch barrel has a mag capacity of 15 rounds. The 3.8 inch barrel has a mag capacity of 10 rounds but you can get the extended mag that holds 15 rounds. Look up all of these 10mm guns on youtube and you will learn what i have learned.
The #1 winner is Springfield xdme.
The #2 winner is M&P. Its true some of them have feeding issues but if you are shooting at a charging bear and the gun jams you still have a chance to unjam it. Or as last scenario throw your gun at the bear.
Glock and Sig tie for last place. The Sig has feeding issues and might go off if you drop it on the ground or in your truck. You might get shot. And Glock might blow up in your hand which would give a bear a good place to start eating his appetizer before moving on to the main course.
FN-510. All reviews i've seen have been good but i have not seen extensive testing on it like i have seen on the other 4 name brands. Good luck with your choice and let us know what you get.
Fatrascal.

A bunch of the stuff on the Glock is hogwash. I’ve been shooting Glock 10mm pistols for 15+ years and no issues with blow ups or leading in factory barrels. I’ve only experienced the Glock smile on cases where they were dangerously over pressure.

I’ve had 2 failures shooting the XD platform from simple dirt intrusion in the gun and zero with the Glocks. I’ve not owned or shot the Sig or M&P.


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[BravoNovember]

I'm just not a fan of glocks. I would never own one.

I use to say the same thing. Until I owned one.

 

[Miflatlander91]

Man kind of a bummer on the m&p I’ll have to look into that more it fits me the absolute best. I’ve shot the xdm elite a fair amount and liked the gun just like the m&p more.


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[fatrascal]

A bunch of the stuff on the Glock is hogwash. I’ve been shooting Glock 10mm pistols for 15+ years and no issues with blow ups or leading in factory barrels. I’ve only experienced the Glock smile on cases where they were dangerously over pressure.

I’ve had 2 failures shooting the XD platform from simple dirt intrusion in the gun and zero with the Glocks. I’ve not owned or shot the Sig or M&P.


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Mike D Texas, I'm glad that you have not had a blow up with your Glocks. But you have had Glock smile which is on the verge of a blow up. You are correct, this problem is a result of high pressure loads. Thats why i mentioned P or P+P ammo which means they are packed with more powder. The bad part about glock is that they do not mention in their instructions not to shoot high pressure factory ammo. They only tell you not to shoot reloads. Yes i owne a couple of glocks in 10mm. A G-20 and G-29 in gen 4. I have read the instructions.
Whats good about glock is that the bullets feed into the barrel easier because they leave a little wiggle room and do not suppirt the round completely making it easier for the bullet to find the hole. Which is fine if you don't shoot the wrong bullet. Whats bad about glock is that they leave a little wiggle room and do not support round completely which allows high pressure bullets to find a week spot and bulge the brass and in worst case scenario blow out. Not my idea of the gun i want in my hand while having a bear encounter. I'm not trying to be a glock hater just trying to make people aware of what they are getting and take precautions. With the glock you could always gett a kkm barrel and alleviate the issue. Fatrascal

 

[BjornF16]

I’ve had a G20 Gen 3 for ~14 years. Have run BB through it over years with no issues. Did upgrade barrel and spring a couple of years ago. Don’t think it really needed it.

I have moved from 220 hc to 190 Barnes from BB.

I don’t run reloads.

Glock 20's Blowing up?

I'll start off by saying first and foremost that I am not looking to poke the bear, troll or get a rise out of anyone. I'm looking for solid info. at I've had a Glock 20 on order for several months now and finally it came in. I've been doing alot of research about upgrading barrels and such...

rokslide.com

 

[Cannonball]

I went with the XD since I EDC a Hellcat and Sportsman's had the gear up package with 6 mags for 550. Felt better to me in hand than the M&P. Sig felt good but was 200 more. I saw recently they had the G20 on sale for under 600

 

[Beendare]

Op,
If you shoot the M&P and like the platform, I would stick with it.

There is a big advantage to staying with a platform- same feel, same ergos

Just test it. If you get one that has feeding issues, a good M&P armorer can fix- no problem.

 

[fatrascal]

I’ve had a G20 Gen 3 for ~14 years. Have run BB through it over years with no issues. Did upgrade barrel and spring a couple of years ago. Don’t think it really needed it.

I have moved from 220 hc to 190 Barnes from BB.

I don’t run reloads.

Glock 20's Blowing up?

I'll start off by saying first and foremost that I am not looking to poke the bear, troll or get a rise out of anyone. I'm looking for solid info. at I've had a Glock 20 on order for several months now and finally it came in. I've been doing alot of research about upgrading barrels and such...

rokslide.com

BjornF16, I read the reference post that you used. Then i went further and read a lot of the post underneath it. Your reference proves the point of people having problems with high power loads. No not everybody has problems but enough of them do have problems. In fact it seems to be a common thing. Most of the research I've done and the videos I've watched have been put out by glock fan boys. Thankfully they have been honest enough to share the glock problems. Those peoples channels are Chukes Outdoors, LWroad, and even Kenny McGill from the Glock Store talks about it. Other channels are The Turkeys Opinion specifically "Can anybody make a reliable 10mm" , and Fortunecookie45lc on "glock smile." Glock was made for defense against humans and there are lots of safe ammo for that purpise. But they are not necessarily made for shooting hard cast bullets at bears. But, there are alternative ammo that glocks can use on bears.
Fatrascal.

 

[BjornF16]

BjornF16, I read the reference post that you used. Then i went further and read a lot of the post underneath it. Your reference proves the point of people having problems with high power loads. No not everybody has problems but enough of them do have problems. In fact it seems to be a common thing. Most of the research I've done and the videos I've watched have been put out by glock fan boys. Thankfully they have been honest enough to share the glock problems. Those peoples channels are Chukes Outdoors, LWroad, and even Kenny McGill from the Glock Store talks about it. Other channels are The Turkeys Opinion specifically "Can anybody make a reliable 10mm" , and Fortunecookie45lc on "glock smile." Glock was made for defense against humans and there are lots of safe ammo for that purpise. But they are not necessarily made for shooting hard cast bullets at bears. But, there are alternative ammo that glocks can use on bears.
Fatrascal.

How many of those with issues were because they ran factory BB hard cast vs reloads?

I thought I had developed an issue with reliability last September with some FTF running BB 220 HC. Turns out the issue was with my original magazine (which had been fully loaded for several years). Switching out to a different magazine solved the issue.

Three different guides I've used in MT run the G20; one using BB 220 HC, one Grizzly Cartridge 200 HC and the other using Underwood 200 HC.

I had to have a gunsmith work over a Kimber 10mm 1911 due to persistent FTE across ALL ammunition tried. Haven't had a problem since.

During a tactical pistol course, I watched a friend have repeated failure to fire issues with a Springfield XD (9mm). Turns out in the heat of the moment, his grip wasn't disengaging the grip safety. He sold that gun and bought a Glock.

I'm content with my G20 and have no worries over reliability.

 

[fatrascal]

How many of those with issues were because they ran factory BB hard cast vs reloads?

I thought I had developed an issue with reliability last September with some FTF running BB 220 HC. Turns out the issue was with my original magazine (which had been fully loaded for several years). Switching out to a different magazine solved the issue.

Three different guides I've used in MT run the G20; one using BB 220 HC, one Grizzly Cartridge 200 HC and the other using Underwood 200 HC.

I had to have a gunsmith work over a Kimber 10mm 1911 due to persistent FTE across ALL ammunition tried. Haven't had a problem since.

During a tactical pistol course, I watched a friend have repeated failure to fire issues with a Springfield XD (9mm). Turns out in the heat of the moment, his grip wasn't disengaging the grip safety. He sold that gun and bought a Glock.

I'm content with my G20 and have no worries over reliability.

Well Sir, I'm just gonna say that no other gun has a bunch of videos called Sig smile or Springfield swell or M&P blowups. The XDs may have had some problems in the past but the XDME is a different gun and is only 1 to 1.5 years old. Maybe some xdme's have had some issues, i don't know. But they are not blowing up in peoples hands.
Again, i'm not a glock hater and as mentioned earlier i owne two glock 10mm's. And i'm truley happy that most people have not had a glock blow up on them. Glock has contributed more to the 10mm world than any other gun manufacturer. They kept 10mm alive when other companies went different routes. Glock sells more polymer guns than anybody. I saw on a post where somebody said glock sells over 1,000 guns per day. I did not believe it and looked it up on the internet. In reality, they sell over 5,000 guns per day. I was flabergasted to see that. With all of this being said they still have some issues with the safety of unsupported chambers. People in Alaska on some of the channels i mentioned who love glock have done their owne extensive tests and are carrying Springfield xdme. So for me its no glock. If you carry glock then good on you but i hope our conversation has made you more aware and more safe. Thats my only wish. Fatrascal.

 

[BjornF16]

Well Sir, I'm just gonna say that no other gun has a bunch of videos called Sig smile or Springfield swell or M&P blowups. The XDs may have had some problems in the past but the XDME is a different gun and is only 1 to 1.5 years old. Maybe some xdme's have had some issues, i don't know. But they are not blowing up in peoples hands.
Again, i'm not a glock hater and as mentioned earlier i owne two glock 10mm's. And i'm truley happy that most people have not had a glock blow up on them. Glock has contributed more to the 10mm world than any other gun manufacturer. They kept 10mm alive when other companies went different routes. Glock sells more polymer guns than anybody. I saw on a post where somebody said glock sells over 1,000 guns per day. I did not believe it and looked it up on the internet. In reality, they sell over 5,000 guns per day. I was flabergasted to see that. With all of this being said they still have some issues with the safety of unsupported chambers. People in Alaska on some of the channels i mentioned who love glock have done their owne extensive tests and are carrying Springfield xdme. So for me its no glock. If you carry glock then good on you but i hope our conversation has made you more aware and more safe. Thats my only wish. Fatrascal.

Pistol blow ups aren't limited to Glocks. Any pistol with an overcharge round is susceptible. Yes, factory Glock 10mm barrels don't fully support the round.

What pistol is this? (hint: not a Glock)

 

[fatrascal]

Pistol blow ups aren't limited to Glocks. Any pistol with an overcharge round is susceptible. Yes, factory Glock 10mm barrels don't fully support the round.

What pistol is this? (hint: not a Glock)

I don't know what kind of gun that is but i'm guessing a glock clone?

 

[jazz3ring]

I have a Springfield XDM Elite in 10MM which have been flawless for me in my limited use. I chose it because it felt the best in my hands. The Glock, by far, felt the least comfortable in my hands.

 

[NSI]

I don't know what kind of gun that is but i'm guessing a glock clone?

Pretty much the opposite, an HK hammer gun.

FWIW all my Glock barrels are KKMs.

-J

 

[fatrascal]

I agree with BjornF16. Every manufacturer has had mishaps and problems with their guns. Springfield at one time had trouble with the grip safety in the old xds. But the xdm has remedied that issue. M&P is working on fixing the issue with mags. Sig fixed the trigger issue when guns were going off when dropped but somehow seem to be having new issues with that problem. But glock has always had poor chamber support and still does with the gen 5. Facts are facts. Fatrascal

 

[Mike D Texas]

Mike D Texas, I'm glad that you have not had a blow up with your Glocks. But you have had Glock smile which is on the verge of a blow up. You are correct, this problem is a result of high pressure loads. Thats why i mentioned P or P+P ammo which means they are packed with more powder. The bad part about glock is that they do not mention in their instructions not to shoot high pressure factory ammo. They only tell you not to shoot reloads. Yes i owne a couple of glocks in 10mm. A G-20 and G-29 in gen 4. I have read the instructions.
Whats good about glock is that the bullets feed into the barrel easier because they leave a little wiggle room and do not suppirt the round completely making it easier for the bullet to find the hole. Which is fine if you don't shoot the wrong bullet. Whats bad about glock is that they leave a little wiggle room and do not support round completely which allows high pressure bullets to find a week spot and bulge the brass and in worst case scenario blow out. Not my idea of the gun i want in my hand while having a bear encounter. I'm not trying to be a glock hater just trying to make people aware of what they are getting and take precautions. With the glock you could always gett a kkm barrel and alleviate the issue. Fatrascal

The one time I did get a smile it was from very overpressure handloads. I have never had an issue with factory loads including Underwood and Buffalo Bore.


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[fatrascal]

The one time I did get a smile it was from very overpressure handloads. I have never had an issue with factory loads including Underwood and Buffalo Bore.


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Mike D Texas, thats good news.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I agree with BjornF16. Every manufacturer has had mishaps and problems with their guns. Springfield at one time had trouble with the grip safety in the old xds. But the xdm has remedied that issue. M&P is working on fixing the issue with mags. Sig fixed the trigger issue when guns were going off when dropped but somehow seem to be having new issues with that problem. But glock has always had poor chamber support and still does with the gen 5. Facts are facts. Fatrascal

The vast majority of the Glock blow ups are 40 S&W chambered pistols.

All other calibers are rare to non-existent.


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